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Winch Line pull maximum

fast_st

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I have a question, can't quite seem to find a good answer. I have a little dozer, its a JD 350 straight, grousers are at about 50% or so, maybe an inch tall remaining from the original snow grousers. (odd stepped cleats) Somewhere just under 9k lbs.

JD suggests that the drawbar pull is in line with 9k lbs in 1st gear and one handbook mentions that winching can provide 2x the maximum drawbar pull.

Has anyone ever measured their max line pull with a strain gauge or load cell? I'm curious, for big pulls do you anchor the blade if you can't get enough traction and need a harder pull?

Eyeball says the winch is running about a 40:1 or better when the engine is at 2500 rpm, that with 100ftlb engine output would net 16-20k ish line pull (not counting driveline losses)

Thanks in advance.
 

mailtrain

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Dec 6, 2008
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retired crane oper,heavy equip,logger
In my opinion if you get 16k out of a older 350 with a winch you are doing good, At a straight pull you are at a mechanical disadvantage. Unlike a skidder with the height and the arch.If you tie off to something this increases the chance of breaking something or a cable break and injury or death to the operator.

All in all use common sense.This is my opinion.
 

Galute

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Apr 25, 2009
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Bald Knob AR
Yes, a winch will definitely pull more than the dozer. But how much all depends on the condition of your equipment. If it's in top shape then it should have no problem pulling it's rated weight. It's not likely however that the tracks will hold it. We frequently have to use a second or third dozer, a dirt pile or large trees for a deadman. If you need to pull more than the rated load you can 2 part the line. That will double it's rated pull without overstressing things. Again, just make sure your tackle is rated for the task at hand, in good condition and you know how to use it properly.
 
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fast_st

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Safety is what its about. My inexperience in dozer winching is what I'm working to whittle down so I'll ask where someone has done it. :) My snatchblocks are McKissick 15T sized for 3/4 rope and the dozer is running a 5/8 steel core cable in good condition. I do my best to keep all the rigging gear well within the rated working loads. I have a Warn MX10000 that I'm used to working with, mounted on a plate with a couple anchor shackles so it'll sit on the trailer deck, lashed to a tree, anyplace its needed. I haven't taken the hundred layers of paint off the winch yet but it has 20 or so 3/4 inch bolts holding it to the frame so it looks like a stout player. Planetary drive and external band brake. Just want to know when the maximums are, 5/8 cable, 20T break strength, 12T anchor shackles etc. Just gathering info so I don't make *that* mistake.
 

markshr151

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May 29, 2010
Messages
176
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central fl.
Make a set of steel plates with a number of holes in it lets say 1/2".You can calculate the force to sheer the bolts.Then use a rope to buffer the shock.Start with a small load and build up. 1. braking stuff can be fun.2.this will help you to feel your tractor 3.Seeing what happens under controlled conditions is way better then hold my beer and watch this.I did not go in to all the details like W.L.L. < breaking limits and clamping force. But you seem to be good and sharp so have fun and ask lots of questions.
 

Dualie

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Feb 23, 2007
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Nor Cal
I can almost assure you that you can out pull the safe working load limit if your winch cable before you stall your winch. A breaking winch cable and flying rigging can and will kill someone.
 

fast_st

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I can almost assure you that you can out pull the safe working load limit if your winch cable before you stall your winch. A breaking winch cable and flying rigging can and will kill someone.

Yeah the Mythbusters episode looked painful, I don't think the crash screen in the back would slow down a 12 pound anchor shackle by much. I've always used a heavy canvas duffel bag with my ropes in it draped over a winchline and keep everyone at a safe distance, at least 1.2x the cable length payed out.

I'll have to check the math again, but it looks like the motor would stall first being pto driven. So far everything I've put the winch cable on has fallen over so its definately worth a second look.

Actually, whereas math can be important, I'm looking at borrowing a 10k crane scale. I can always put a snatch on a big tree and pull at a 45 to reduce the force then use those funny buttons on the calculator. Indeed it hasn't seemed to load down but again I don't know what it took to yank the widowmakers over.
 

mailtrain

Active Member
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Dec 6, 2008
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Northern N.Y.
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retired crane oper,heavy equip,logger
To determine the safe load of wire rope(plow steel). Safe load in tons is 8 times the diameter in inches squared. Don't know if this is what you were looking for it's good info to know.

Example: 1/2 rope =1/2x 1/2 =1/4 x 8 = 2tons
________________________________________________
steel core plow steel plow steel improved

5/8" 3.44 tons 3.76 tons

3/4" 4.95 5.38 tons

1" 8.82 tons 9.46 tons
 

LonestarCobra

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Sep 4, 2008
Messages
228
Location
WV
When I have to go on a pull job with a winch dozer, normally with a 6R I dont need to anchor unless the load is extra heavy such as a stuck well service rig or something. Even then, by sinking the backrippers in usually that is enough to pull the load. If you power the blade down, and spin the tracks a little it creates a good nest to winch out the heaviest loads. You would be suprised what you can pull with a winch that you cant pull with the drawbar. With the old D5B, I have pulled some large loads out of the mud, up steep hills and let them back down. We have a rig up truck that has three of the new Tulsa winches with the load minder system. It shows how much pull you have as you are pulling. I dont care for those hydraulic winches, but they are safer. When moving rigs, it is not uncommon to see over 70,000 lbs on the 1 1/8" line. Good common sense and experience on your equipment will go a long way.
 

Will Musser

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Dec 19, 2009
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54
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Oklahoma
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Heavyhauler/ Truckbuilder
I've done alot of pull work with my D6D and winch. We just push down with the blade and lock the brakes. When enough dirt piles up behind you, the load will move. I've had dirt stacked up over the fuel tank while winching before. I always use atleast one snatch block though, and sometimes another D6D for a deadman. Only broke a line once and that was scooting a full triple drilling rig in one piece. ALWAYS mke everyone get back before you ever put the winch in gear though. Had a friend kill a guy when a chain broke while winchin on a old boxcar with a D5 96J. The tailchain on his broke a hit the guy in the head when it recoiled. I read somewhere that the winch on it was rated for 80k line pull.
 

fast_st

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Did some experimenting a few weeks back, Was trying to uproot a large oak, was short on the grab point height. cable full out -5 wraps, At idle it'd drag the 350 up the hill like a dog on an auto rewind leash. Anchor the dozer and it pretty much instantly snapped a grade 70 3/8 transport chain (16k break) and still didnt' seem to load down very much, cable with blanket only recoiled about 50 of the 100 feet, no idea where that one chain link went. Still working to borrow a 20k crane scale and see what happens next.

Backhoe helped by severing a few large surface roots.
 
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