500ton trucks...

alco · May 2, 2009

The ground isn't really frozen solid. There is enough heat coming off the deposit that, although there is frost, and it can be thick, it is always warm underneath and therefore not frozen. Look at ice, it flexes and moves as weight is applied on top of it, this stuff is similar in that aspect. Like Ben said, 600 tons moves frost pretty easily too.

Brian

Tenspot · May 28, 2009

And to think buying a set of tires for a 797 is scary enough

LuNaTIcFrEAk · Jun 3, 2009

Dayton3 said:
Could you produce tires which could handle much heavier loads by increasing the width of the tires instead of increasing their diameters?

This has already been done, the current 63" tires on the market are wide base.

I have been designing the wheels for these large truck for years and I don't see any bigger tires coming out any time soon. If the 500+ ton mark is broken I think it will be a truck with the same GVW as the current ultra class, but using newer materials and frame designs to reduce the truck weight. Every lbs you can remove from the truck is another lbs of dirt you can add to the back.

Dayton3 · Jun 8, 2009

^I guess the 1,000 tonners that some have suggested are probably out of the question then.

alco · Jun 13, 2009

The 500 ton class will be broken someday. I don't see it being done as Lunaticfreak suggests though. The more weight you take away, the more pay load you can carry, yes, this is true. But most of the weight will no be able to be removed, and if you start cutting material from some components and structures, you will inevitably weaken them. With the conditions these trucks face all day long, that would add up to failure of components or structures alarmingly fast.

If anything, I see there being a break for a while and then a slow build up to a larger size tire, then truck. It may even take a different wheel/axle configuration to get there, but with modern technology, that may not have the same issues that past designs had with tandem trucks, or other setups.

Now 1000 tonners, yeah, I think that may be a bit out there.

Brian

JDOFMEMI · Jun 16, 2009

I wonder what happened to Eddie at the Emerites Truck Factory??

He used to follow the thread and comment.

I suspect that they have had some setbacks.

While the design may be far fetched, it is good to see some creative thinking. It is tougher to get the $$ to support that kind of thinking though.

Dayton3 · Jun 19, 2009

JDOFMEMI said:
I wonder what happened to Eddie at the Emerites Truck Factory??

He used to follow the thread and comment.

I suspect that they have had some setbacks.

While the design may be far fetched, it is good to see some creative thinking. It is tougher to get the $$ to support that kind of thinking though.

I wonder what the capacity of some of the trucks featured at the ETF site would be if they were built with the tires, engines, and other equipment used on the CAT 797 or the T-282?

LuNaTIcFrEAk · Jun 19, 2009

alco said:
The 500 ton class will be broken someday. I don't see it being done as Lunaticfreak suggests though. The more weight you take away, the more pay load you can carry, yes, this is true. But most of the weight will no be able to be removed, and if you start cutting material from some components and structures, you will inevitably weaken them. With the conditions these trucks face all day long, that would add up to failure of components or structures alarmingly fast.

Weight does not always equal strength, as we utilize more advanced design abilities such as FEA, and new age materials become more cost affective, weight can be reduced without sacrificing strength. With all the big truck manufacturers I deal with, weight reduction is a huge part of each new truck design.
Not saying I am right, just my prediction.

alco · Jun 20, 2009

LuNaTIcFrEAk said:
Weight does not always equal strength, as we utilize more advanced design abilities such as FEA, and new age materials become more cost affective, weight can be reduced without sacrificing strength. With all the big truck manufacturers I deal with, weight reduction is a huge part of each new truck design.
Not saying I am right, just my prediction.

No, weight doesn't always equal strength. But the work I have seen them doing to truck frames up here is mostly beefing up weak points to reduce the cracking issues. There is no way they can make large leaps in payload capacity by doing redesign work on existing models. They may make small gains here and there, but nothing too substantial.

Brian

B.U.S.I. · Jun 23, 2009

This may have already been mentioned, but what about a tandem axle arrangement on a truck in the 500-600 ton size? (kind of like the old Titan and Wabco trucks) That way the tire diameter would stay the same as the 360-400 ton trucks. I realize the % of payload vs. tare would go down with the extra axle resulting in worse $/ton. But it could be built couldn't it?

CATBEATER · Jun 24, 2009

WABCO 3200B had a poor turning radius due to the tandem axle, it also was rough on the rear tires for the same reason, I dont think you will see that design coming back. I still have a picture of that truck on the office wall

Right next to the picture of 930E with no driver. The future is autonomus.

RioCan · Aug 11, 2009

500 ton truck would sure be a monster... but would be fun to drive it

buddy605 · Aug 11, 2009

Hi Rio I am assuming you are in the wabush mines. What about a tandam with the front and rear act as stearing axles and power going only to the rigid axle.

alco · Aug 12, 2009

Last time they came out with that kind of system, it proved to be a maintenance nightmare. Who knows if they could have better luck with modern technology. My biggest concern is that with more moving parts, you have higher wear and maintenance.

Brian

CATBEATER · Aug 19, 2009

When you say more moving parts = higher wear and maintenance are you refering to CAT transmissions/ final drives vs Komatsu electric drive systems? Has anyone heard new information about the CAT electric drive truck or have they given up? I just went through a mine induction here in AU and they have added a new procedure. One honk for start up, two for forward, three for reverse and four to pass the CAT truck coming out of the pit.

alco · Aug 19, 2009

CATBEATER said:
When you say more moving parts = higher wear and maintenance are you refering to CAT transmissions/ final drives vs Komatsu electric drive systems?

Nope, I was referring to the rear steering axle tried out in the past. But I guess it would apply in the context you stated as well. Since the Komatsus won't get any wear while waiting at the shop to get fixed while the Cats earn their keep in the mine.

Brian

MrElectric03 · Aug 19, 2009

CATBEATER said:
When you say more moving parts = higher wear and maintenance are you refering to CAT transmissions/ final drives vs Komatsu electric drive systems? Has anyone heard new information about the CAT electric drive truck or have they given up? I just went through a mine induction here in AU and they have added a new procedure. One honk for start up, two for forward, three for reverse and four to pass the CAT truck coming out of the pit.

Lol, nice pic. Thats a good one.

MrElectric03 · Aug 19, 2009

alco said:
Nope, I was referring to the rear steering axle tried out in the past. But I guess it would apply in the context you stated as well. Since the Komatsus won't get any wear while waiting at the shop to get fixed while the Cats earn their keep in the mine.

Brian

While I feel Komatsu has a superior truck, unfortunatly you are right that Komatsus sit in the shop a while...because CATs product support is far superior

rosewood · Aug 19, 2009

MrElectric03 said:
While I feel Komatsu has a superior truck, unfortunatly you are right that Komatsus sit in the shop a while...because CATs product support is far superior

Hmmmm -- wonder why Komatsu doesn't have any more than a 10% share in the big truck market if they are so superior.
Must be a lot of equipment purchasers out there that aren't real smart.

Question.
How do you double the trade in price of a Komatsu machine.

Answer.
Make sure it is full of fuel.

MrElectric03 · Aug 20, 2009

rosewood said:
Hmmmm -- wonder why Komatsu doesn't have any more than a 10% share in the big truck market if they are so superior.
Must be a lot of equipment purchasers out there that aren't real smart.

Question.
How do you double the trade in price of a Komatsu machine.

Answer.
Make sure it is full of fuel.

Not trying to start stuff, just respectfully giving my opinion of the equipment I have worked on, and a big reason for that is what I stated above, CAT has a top notch parts and product support system that no other company can match. Anyone who honestly thinks that a perfect machine is made has some screws loose. A smart customer looks into product support of a peice of equipment before buying it.

500ton trucks...

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