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Loader control question?? which is better?

MDD

Active Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2007
Messages
28
Location
Maryland
I've only had joystick control loaders, but was offered a deal on one with the the 3 finger tip controls. I've never even operated one like that.

How do they worK. What are the advantages?
 

farm_boy

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2006
Messages
369
Location
The sunflower state
Hello MDD,

To go back in history a little will help understand why there are two different control patterns. Back in the day there were two lever controls that had levers close to 2' long and were either connected directly to the control valve or were connected via a cable. Because the lever throws were so long is was nearly impossible to work both levers while in the pile, so the boom lever was often placed into a detented "up" position while the operator worked the bucket with the tilt function. This detent was also used when coming up to a truck or hopper to raise the booom while the operator used the tilt lever to dump the bucket at the same time.

The single lever control was designed as an improved control pattern over the two lever pattern as it is decribed above. This allowed the operator to have full control over all functions while loading the bucket and dumping into a truck.

Today the difference between the two patterns is not as aparent because the advent of pilot and EH controls. You will typically find the joystick or single lever controls on smaller, < 4 cu yd, loaders. The thought is that these smaller loaders are usually used in a variety of different applications that don't have the repetitive motions that a larger loader would have by doing nothing but v-pattern loading. It is also thought that this loader control is easier for new or inexperienced operators to pick up on as well.

The two lever controls of today are quite different from those days of 2' levers. Almost without exception all manufactures use either pilot controllers or EH controls that provide for short levers and very little movement effort. For the most part, larger loaders (> 4 cu yd) come standard with type of controls. Not that you can't get a joystick with these larger machines, but because of the high percentage of the time that these machines perform repetitive v-pattern loading it is thought that the short, two lever controls give the operator much better metering control over the bucket while coming up to and dumping in a truck or hopper.

On a personal note, I grew up running single lever controls and now that two lever machines have such short levers and provide such a nice metering feel, I actually prefer these over the joysticks of today. With that being said I think that some manufactures have better two lever controls than others. I like the feel of the Deere and Cat EH two lever controls. Case/New Holland also have a decent feel. I don't care for the Volvo controls as they, in my opinion, don't have enough resistance. I also don't like the Komatsu pilot/EH controls nor do I like the Cat pilot controls. Both have levers that are too long for my tastes.
 

Turbo21835

Senior Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2007
Messages
1,135
Location
Road Dog
What make and model? Also, i take it the third finger tip control is for a third function similar to a loader I ran a few years ago.
0610070015.jpg


The third control on that loader controlled the top portion of the bucket. Its a hell of a set up. The only thing I liked more about a joystick was it seemed easier to use all three functions at once. The spacing on the finger tip controls is easy for two finger use, but if you have the third function it seemed hard to use all three at the same time.

Problems, were not many. It is a good control system. Cat did have a few issues when they first came out. Mostly with dirt getting into the control electronics. Lets face it, ac in machines is not for operator comfort, rather its to save the electronics. I did have some issues with control when it was damp out. That problem was solved with a new set of controls per the Cat mechanics recomendation.
 

MDD

Active Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2007
Messages
28
Location
Maryland
thanks for the great responses guys. It is an 06 or 07 Deere 544J.

So I take it that the lever style control is better!?!

Im just so used to the joysticks, I dont want to make a bad decision. The machine is far away and would have to be hauled in, so no test ride..
 

dirt digger

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2008
Messages
598
Location
PA
Occupation
pushing dirt, baling hay, and hitting the books
i much prefer finger tip controls in trackloaders...then again i also prefer 3 stick CASE controls on backhoes too...maybe i just like more levers to pull
 

Stick Pro

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 15, 2007
Messages
154
Location
Fresno CA
i have the singel controls on all of our track loaders and our 928 we rented a 950 one time with the two levers i got used to it in no time but i still prefer the joystick i fell like i have more control of the tractor just my opinion
 

95zIV

Senior Member
Joined
Mar 11, 2006
Messages
795
Location
Cincinnati, OH
Occupation
RR Contractor Super.
Most guys on here don't do this, but if you plan on using the loader with a pusher to plow snow the two sticks are nice too. When you use those you are supposed to set the bucket angle then just pick the arms to dump/clear snow so this way if you don't touch that bucket lever you don't have to worry about it. With a joystick it's easier to move your bucket curl. I've run them both in both v loading and jobsite support, I personally prefer the 2 stick.
 

MDD

Active Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2007
Messages
28
Location
Maryland
i have the singel controls on all of our track loaders and our 928 we rented a 950 one time with the two levers i got used to it in no time but i still prefer the joystick i fell like i have more control of the tractor just my opinion

I have a feeling I will be more partial to the joystick as well..
 

JDOFMEMI

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2007
Messages
3,074
Location
SoCal
To me it comes down to what you are doing with it. If you are doing a wide variety of utility work, I would prefer the joystick, but if digging and loading is the main function, give me two sticks. If you spend all day digging and dumping, the ability to detent the boom raise is priceless. Also the control while dumping seems better, and it is easier to maintain a steady cycle. Going over rough ground can disrupt the cycle with a joystick, since you are holding it, not just letting it raise up while in detent. Gives you time to move your arm around, scratch your nose, trip a load counter, or salute the truck driver.
 

MDD

Active Member
Joined
Apr 8, 2007
Messages
28
Location
Maryland
My main use would be for tramming gravel around for sewer/utility installs, and misc. job site stuff.
 

OCR

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Messages
1,195
Location
Montana
Occupation
Rancher/Farmer, Wildland Fire Fighter, State snowp
I have a feeling I will be more partial to the joystick as well..
Hello again MDD,

Of course it's a personal preference... but I favor the 4 function joy stick for
loader and bucket myself.

Our old Hough 80B has 2 levers... for lift and bucket... and the lever throw is
too long to use both in unison with the same hand.

The MDT loaders that I run have joysticks, so you don't have to move your hand from one control to the other.

Our JD 750c dozer has one joystick for all 6 way blade functions...

Back/forward for raise/lower...side/side for tilt... and twist, right/left for angle...
I really like that control set up, because you can use 3 functions at the same
time... that is... raise/lower, tilt, and angle... with out moving your hand off the lever.


OCR

PS. I also ran a Cat loader with joystick steering... not sure, but I think it was
a 988 or the next size up, and I loved it too... no cranking that cussed steering wheel around and wearing out your arm... seemed very smooth too.

Also ran a Cat with that "half thing of a joke" steering wheel... and you can probably gather... I didn't care for that control set up.
 
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Northart

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2007
Messages
761
Location
Talkeetna, Alaska
Airplane Steering wheel ?

Here's the airplane steering wheel ,as I call it. Cat 980G.
 

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OCR

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Messages
1,195
Location
Montana
Occupation
Rancher/Farmer, Wildland Fire Fighter, State snowp
Airplane Steering wheel ?

Here's the airplane steering wheel ,as I call it. Cat 980G.

Yup, that's what it was... didn't make much sense to me, you still had to have your arm extended out to use it. Just didn't have to crank on it as much.

That set up seemed some what awkward to me... where as the joystick
steering felt intuitive and smooth... of course I'm used to joysticks... and I
like them as a control device.

Thanks Northart,


OCR

PS. Looking at your picture again... I remember the two yellow buttons for forward and reverse... and also used for gear selection???
I can't remember exactly what you used to change speed ranges.

But, if you held the wheel any where other than top left... you had to move
your hand back to push the buttons... just seemed... well... irritating.
 
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Northart

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2007
Messages
761
Location
Talkeetna, Alaska
Gear Shifting ?

The left yellow button upshifts, and the right yellow button downshifts .

Got to look at the screen, to see what gear you are in.
 

Northart

Senior Member
Joined
Dec 2, 2007
Messages
761
Location
Talkeetna, Alaska
Forward / Reverse ?

Forward / Reverse is the rocker switch underneath your left hand. Not visible in the picture. Where your fingers are. Wish I had another picture.

Gear shifting is done with the thumb. F/R is done with the index finger.
 

OCR

Senior Member
Joined
Feb 21, 2008
Messages
1,195
Location
Montana
Occupation
Rancher/Farmer, Wildland Fire Fighter, State snowp
Forward / Reverse ?

Yup... yup... I remember now... can't see it because it's under the wheel.

But, I do recall the rocker switch that you used your finger to operate.

There... I think we have that straightened out and under control... :)

Thanks Northart,


OCR

PS. Actually, Northart... If you look real hard... I think you can just glimpse the
rocker switch in your picture... just slightly to the inside of wheel isn't it?

And... we kinda steered this thread off track a little... didn't we?... :)
 
Last edited:

Tex3406

Active Member
Joined
Sep 27, 2008
Messages
42
Location
South Australia
Forward/reverse is a rocker switch under the steering wheel, under the buttons. You use your thumb for the up/down buttons, fingers for fwd/rev.
 

nkh111

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 28, 2008
Messages
67
Location
missouri
I learned on a joy stick highlift. But now I run a 2 lever machine and I lke it 100 times better. It seems to have a better feel to what the machine is doing. It's purely personal preferance
 

Bellboy

COPPA
Joined
Dec 1, 2007
Messages
745
Location
KZN South Africa
Occupation
Student
I ran a Bell L2306C, not related to JD, and it had a joystick. It was a big machine, and it had all of the shifting and gear selection on the joystick. It was a nightmare. I would love to run a 2 lever combo, seeing as it is getting a lot of praise. I would hate to run a LongGong machine, it has 2 long levers, that are mounted next to the seat and go all the way to the floor of the cab!!
 
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