Deere/Hitachi

It's now official.

https://www.deere.com/en/news/all-news/deere-hitachi-joint-venture-closure/

I think I posted something on that in the other thread {r to r}.

But aren't both brands of excavators made in Japan in the Hitachi plant and shipped off from there to their end destination around the world, exactly what is made in the plants listed as to now owned by Deere??

Randy88 said:

exactly what is made in the plants listed as to now owned by Deere??

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The 160 up to the 350 excavators (except reduced tail swing excavators) have been built at those factories for years.

Which plants make what?? The reason I'm asking is because this topic came up locally a few days ago, a local town was wanting to buy an new excavator and told every salesman they only wanted to buy an American made product that was actually made in the United States and even the Deere salesperson told the city council none of their excavators were made or assembled in the United States, only Komatsu or bobcat had plants here, nobody else did, everything was shipped in from somewhere else, it pretty much shut up the whole city council and the discussion was tabled for now, since they had already stated they would only buy an American made and assembled new excavator and neither bobcat nor Komatsu were asked to put in bids on a new excavator for that city.

So who makes what, where?? and who now owns Hitachi, one rumor I heard yesterday is Volvo is buying them back again??

Randy88 said:

So who makes what, where?? and who now owns Hitachi

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All the excavators (13-47 metric ton) are built in Kernersville, NC. They have been for years (since 1988). Canadian plant does mostly Forestry I believe. I don't know what range they build in Brazil. And Hitachi owns Hitachi. In the U.S. they fall under the umbrella of Hitachi Construction Machinery America's Inc.

So the jest is from what I've been told, shortly until Hitachi decides who's going to handle their parts for their excavators, deere is going to be shut off from them completely and as of yet, there is no Hitachi excavator dealership named or established, in the midwest, let alone the parts stocked and in place to serve the customers who own those machines, since up to now, you had to deal with Deere to get the parts or lack there of parts according to Deere for the Hitachi machines. Is that about right?

Both Deere dealers we work with told me that they have an agreement for support parts/services for machines sold under joint venture. That being said they added ‘if available’. Which in today’s world encompasses all manufacturers. Even filters can be difficult to get. We have 3 all Deere machines and one Deere/Hitachi machine. So far no issues with anything but have not had any major component issues

We don't drain anything or take off any filters until we have the oil and filters to go back on, been there and done that, had a truck down for two months last year after draining the oil on the transmission only to find out, the oil needed was on back order??

I have plenty of machines of all colors and brands needing parts, which are either on backorder or can't be bought at all, but nothing serious enough to shut those machines down except for one, the rest we can keep running right now, just happens the Hitachi is the machine in need of so called obsolete parts, but I've been through this before with deere only to find out a few months later, they had the parts for years in a warehouse somewhere just wanted you to trade your hitachi off for a new or used Deere instead.

Your right though, every manufacturer is in about the same situation, which makes me wonder exactly which one is paying attention and will actually learn from this ordeal and start to make their own parts again instead of outsourcing them all to whoever will make it the cheapest, from the engines to transmissions to the computer that controls the ignition switch to everything else in between. The next major question is, are all the electronics and computers really that badly needed to make and keep these machines running, its a very sad day when a lack of a replacement 100 dollar sensor can shut down and keep a several hundred thousand dollar machine from starting and stay running.

Just last month I was at one local dealership and while chatting with the mechanics about an issue with one of my machines, they said, take a look at this nearly new tractor, low hour, almost new tires, looked pristine in every way shape and form...........it was being auctioned off to salvage yards, seems the computer is obsolete and without it, the tractor can't be started, run or sold and the dealer could get about as much for it for salvage right now that they could if it ran, so they gave up trying to find a fix for the computer and sold it to salvage instead.

Absolutely agree on the draining and filter thing - we do the same. Yes, hopefully some of the manufacturers will pay attention and make some changes - not only making our own here - but actually having a supply of parts on hand - this just-in-time crap has caught up and is biting hard - and unless contractors start making their voices heard - nothing will change because it is all about showing profit margins.

We had our tile crew shut down for two weeks last fall waiting on a $134.00 sensor - specialized machine and extremely limited suppliers - two weeks when weather is good is a killer in our line of work - I know it is in any type of work but harder on us working in the ag community.

I have seen machines like you mentioned - almost new low hour - sitting at dealers waiting on parts - but none sold for salvage yet. The whole obsolete thing gets under my skin as not all of us can afford to trade to the newest greatest thing every 2-5 years - heck 80% of our equipment is now considered obsolete by today's thought processes.

Hitachi sold controlling share in the company to a holding company called Itochu Corp.

https://www.forconstructionpros.com...ng-stake-in-hitachi-construction-machinery-co

Was just told yesterday, a friend of mine has an excavator that is a 2005 model year, and whatever part he's waiting on, is obsolete and can't be bought so they told him he needed to get into the real world and buy something newer...............turns out it is the newest piece of machinery he owns and also the lowest hour as well and he had no plans to update it in his lifetime, maybe not even in his son's lifetime.

I think the harsh reality of today is starting to sink in, that anything made in the last 20 years isn't going to be around in 40 years from now and still run, none of the major components can run with computers and wiring harness's and most can't be bought anymore or fixed, its been said many times any new machine is just one mouse away from the salvage yard, and I think its a vivid reality more so every day. If a mouse chews the wiring harness in the wrong place, the whole harness needs to be replaced, not patched and most can't be bought and those that can, are out of stock and on back order so long, salvage might as well end up with the machine, most can't wait six months to a over a years for simple things.

Td, you were down for two weeks, I know of a couple of people who were down for the whole season and might not be up and running this spring................for a machine under warranty and waiting on parts...........and they still get to make the payments without any income to do it with. I also know of some who got those simple sensors replaced only to have them fail before the tech that put them in got back to the company shop and waited again for weeks for the replacement sensors replacement to show up or the computer chip or micro processor that was under warranty to get made, shutting the whole machine down for months...........or is still shut down yet today after being down all last fall as well.

As they say everything is great as long as it works, when it doesn't, life just got a whole lot harder and more difficult.

My sons work in the repair field, and they keep telling me to not update equipment, right now we can basically keep things going. With computers and software and sensors needed your pretty much screwed and dead in the water when something goes down, they see it every day, months delays waiting on electronics to show up to fix things, or reprogram the computers to bypass certain items to keep the machines running till the computer shuts them down again in so many hours of bypassing components to only reset the perimeters within the computer to trick it into thinking its fixed temporary. I hear the constant complaints every day from them on the lack of parts from everyone, things and people waiting on parts most don't know about but I get told. As one of my son's said, last year was great, this year might suck, but the year after that unless something major changes, is going to be unbearable to say the least.

If my machine was down for more than a month the dealer can have it back if it's under warranty I sure as hell ain't making a payment

We had this problem about 20 years ago with booms on cat backhoes they were breaking left and right dad finally loaded up 7 machines that were on payments kicked them off at the dealer said good luck and went and picked up other machines from a different dealer about 10 hours later they started producing results

The problem with parts is the industry has accepted this mentality of miraculous warranty and trade machines in outside of warranty so manufacturers dont design for a twenty year investment anymore they design for a 5 year warranty period and parts supplies resemble this mind set witch is why nothing is ever on the shelf

This will not get better until manufacturers feel the same pain that the end user feels by not being able to generate revenue from broke down equipment

Stopping payments and taking a machine back is not something that should be considered without legal counseling. The finance company is a separate company and has nothing to do with the performance of the machine. I've seen it happen where a company stopped payment on an asset and the finance company sued and won a lot more than they were owed.
It works much better to negotiate your problem in the new media. Make a call to the local television news station and their problem fixer. Once it gets on the air, there will be all kinds of phone calls and action concerning your problems.

Well a lot of issues is also the whole mixed bag of new parts to make up a new machine, with many trenchers, tile plows and etc, the manufacturer gets an engine from source number one of one brand and finals from another, lasers and gps from a third and hydro pumps and motors from someone different yet, once it goes down under warranty, the machine and all the components are covered, but not necessarily by the manufacturer of the machine as a whole, the engine is covered by its own manufacturer, so when cat sells that engine to the plow manufacturer, the plow manufacturer has literally nothing to do with the warranty on the engine, you deal with cat directly, cat comes out with their service team to fix it, if parts are not available, your not taking any machine back to the plow manufacturer and just dumping it off and pinning a 20 dollar bill to their chest and saying, best of luck, your stuck and its your machine, the other issue is, the local cat dealership never sold that engine, got a commission, had anything to do with it what so ever, so you go to the bottom of the list as far as their concerned of importance, if they even care enough to put your name on the list in the first place, especially during the busy season when they are stretched thin anyhow. If your renting or leasing it, you can argue all you want about the payments, most or all your going to make anyhow, the one who wrote the contract has all that worked into it with all the legal loopholes already covered. If in doubt, tell whatever manufacturer your dealing with, you'll get your own personal lawyer to draw up a contract and have them sign it, see how long it takes to be shown the door and told to never come back. Business's have many legal staff on hand to figure this all out long before anything ever gets sold, leased, rented or whatever, the buyer is the one who has no experience with the legal aspects of it.........but get to find out later on down the road how it all works.

We were going to upgrade our tile plow this winter - but with wait times for machines and prices that are unrealistic in terms of a machine paying for itself before it is worn out - we decided to wait - ours is in very good condition and as of right now we have no known issues. Yes, we felt fortunate to get our parts in a couple of weeks. That would really be difficult to miss a whole fall season - and maybe this spring season. We are two years into this mess of short supplies and rising costs now - makes one wonder when this is going to come to a head and pop because it has not gotten any better - as all of you commenting have shared - and it will be ugly when it happens. Glad we are in a position where my partner (wife) and I decided several years ago that we would only buy if we could write a check for it. We are a small business with 3 employees besides us two - we do not have new and shiny tech-full stuff, but it is well maintained - works when we need it to - and we sleep better without payments to anyone.

Randy88 sent me a link to the news station and I used a search function provided by that web site to find this link to the report he likely heard.

https://www.kwwl.com/news/john-deer...cle_888a4eee-abc5-11ec-bbb6-8b6f93cb3d1f.html

That date on the report is March 24 but the executive order referred to in the report is sometime in July but gives no year and doesn't say that it specifically mentioned John Deere. The report in the link is about Deere planning to provide more software allowing customers to do more with their own machines. I'll look for the executive order later today and see what it says.

I got this in the wrong thread. I'll post it in the right to repair thread with additional information.