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John deere 450c binding up and kills engine.

J

JRsEquipment

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Joined
Nov 19, 2013
Messages
69
Location
Orlando Florida
The hydraulics or trans are killing the engine no matter what, just start it don't move any levers or put it in gear and the engine loads up really bad and dies. Wont spin over with the starter unless you let it sit for a minute or 3 and fires back up and does it again. Everything works, even if you drive machine or operate hydraulics engine still binds up and dies. Machine was dropped of here for left steer clutch not disengaging, they unloaded it and drove about 300ft so it wasn't doing it until sat for a few weeks now only runs for a min or so or I can travel about 10 ft. Anyone familiar with this machine or any ideas where to start??

Thanks!
 
Vetech63

Vetech63

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Aug 10, 2016
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You need the Deere God my friend. He will want the model and serial number of the machine.
 
BigWrench55

BigWrench55

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Oct 11, 2018
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Somewhere
Does it turn over slow while cranking?
Sounds like a hydraulic pump is at full stroke.
I don't have anything to add besides that.
Post the serial number and mg2361 will come by before too long. And will be able to help you better.
 
J

JRsEquipment

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Joined
Nov 19, 2013
Messages
69
Location
Orlando Florida
450CD 283871T
It spins over fine initially, however after the motor lugs down and kills it the starter won't even spin it over and then the more you let it sit the pressure goes away and it'll fire right back up
 
BigWrench55

BigWrench55

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I am not familiar with your machine. I am merely giving advice from past experience on other machines. MG2361 will be the person to ask.
 
D

Delmer

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Jan 3, 2013
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MG will know, if he hasn't forgotten it long ago. This is a smallish 70's dozer with a small gear pump for operating one or two functions most often, it's not an excavator where the hydraulic pump WILL stall the engine. The engine should send the hydraulic pump pieces into orbit, even idling cold. or the starter should run the pump over the relief, maybe?

Does the engine die fighting, like lots of noise and dark smoke out the exhaust? or slow down and no smoke or noise? or something else?

Can you turn the engine by hand to see how it feels? then do it again immediately after it dies?

Sounds crazy, but don't forget the fan belts.
 
mg2361

mg2361

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Jul 5, 2016
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Equipment Mechanic
Several questions,
1. Clutch free pedal adjustment at 3.75"?
2. Does the clutch feel like it works and releases? If so does it stall with the pedal down.
Remember just because the clutch feels like it is working the clutch disc might be frozen (not ice) to the flywheel so it is trying to turn the transmission even with the pedal down, which leads to my next question.
3. The HLR transmission is in neutral correct? Just because the lever is on "N" doesn't mean it is adjusted correctly.
4. All the hydraulic spools are in neutral as well?
5. Does the unit have a winch?
 
Tyler d4c

Tyler d4c

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Mar 2, 2016
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1,830
Location
Salix Pa
Oh yes the winch a guy near me has that problem once a year or so. Then I made him a lock so no one could kick it in gear.
 
J

JRsEquipment

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Joined
Nov 19, 2013
Messages
69
Location
Orlando Florida
The last time it lugged down and died last week, that was it, it drags really bad now and wont even start, last week if you let it sit it would spin over really fast and fire right up, then regardless if you worked the hydraulics or not, traveled or not, pushed the clutch in or not, still loads up really bad and dies, it is not dying on its own(fuel etc) it its being lugging down and dying. If my memory is correct clutch pedal was disengaging when pushed. Hydraulics are not building up pressure, only has 2 spools, one for blade raise and one aux with quick couplers, no winch. Trans is in neutral, nothing is being activated when engine dies, no blade lift, no tracks moving etc.

UPDATE: So although the battery was not dead, I got it fired up with a booster, clutch is definitely disengaging, engine ran for about a minute and then lugged down and died. Sounded like a bearing screeched to a halt right when it came to a stop. Just not sure where to start.
 
Last edited:
B

Bluox

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Jun 19, 2010
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1,960
Location
WA state
JRsEquipment said:
The last time it lugged down and died last week, that was it, it drags really bad now and wont even start, last week if you let it sit it would spin over really fast and fire right up, then regardless if you worked the hydraulics or not, traveled or not, pushed the clutch in or not, still loads up really bad and dies, it is not dying on its own(fuel etc) it its being lugging down and dying. If my memory is correct clutch pedal was disengaging when pushed. Hydraulics are not building up pressure, only has 2 spools, one for blade raise and one aux with quick couplers, no winch. Trans is in neutral, nothing is being activated when engine dies, no blade lift, no tracks moving etc.

UPDATE: So although the battery was not dead, I got it fired up with a booster, clutch is definitely disengaging, engine ran for about a minute and then lugged down and died. Sounded like a bearing screeched to a halt right when it came to a stop. Just not sure where to start.
Click to expand...
Pull the engine oil filter and see what's in it.
Bob
 
Dave Neubert

Dave Neubert

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Jul 18, 2018
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Monroe NC
I was going to say sounds like a main bearing drop oil and look for metal also like bob said cut filter sounds like you will be pulling a motor
 
Tyler d4c

Tyler d4c

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End of the balance shift broke off and no more oil pump going round and round. Saw it happen to a 4045
 
77Ford

77Ford

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Feb 24, 2021
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92
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Missouri
The 450c probably has a bypass control valve, make sure that has not got bumped. If it's engaged and nothing connected it will bind the hydraulics down like that.
 
J

JRsEquipment

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Nov 19, 2013
Messages
69
Location
Orlando Florida
Well, as no one asked me to check the engine oil, neither did I as it was just dropped of here for repairs, however HAD NO OIL IN THE ENGINE!!! Or at least took 2 gallons! Surprisingly seams the engine has survived, at least for now.
 
B

Bluox

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WA state
JRsEquipment said:
Well, as no one asked me to check the engine oil, neither did I as it was just dropped of here for repairs, however HAD NO OIL IN THE ENGINE!!! Or at least took 2 gallons! Surprisingly seams the engine has survived, at least for now.
Click to expand...
I'm gonna bet it didn't survive.
It's unbelievable you would start a motor without checking the oil and water must less start it multiply times.
Bob
 
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