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Motor Grader

skyhightree1

Active Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2008
Messages
33
Location
Richmond,Va
Occupation
Business Owner
Hey may sound like a stupid question ... probably is but I have never had the opportunity to use a motor grader Is it difficult to learn to use effectively I want one cause i have property with a 3 mile long dirt road and its a pain in the #%% to grade that road with a box blade I was thinking of buying a older model to just leave out there. Can anyone help me also with what would be a good older grader to buy?
 

Dirt Devil

Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2008
Messages
20
Location
Monash, South Australia
Occupation
school student, tafe student
Hey skyhightree1, better to ask a stupid question than to go into it with no info! Well thats how i see it anyway :p I wouldn't mind knowing a bit more either, all those levers and controls must take a little experience to get over :)
 

Grader4me

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 11, 2006
Messages
1,792
Location
New Brunswick, Canada
Hey may sound like a stupid question ... probably is but I have never had the opportunity to use a motor grader Is it difficult to learn to use effectively I want one cause i have property with a 3 mile long dirt road and its a pain in the #%% to grade that road with a box blade I was thinking of buying a older model to just leave out there. Can anyone help me also with what would be a good older grader to buy?


I guess its according to what you want to pay as to what you're going to get. Look around and you might pick an old one up at a reasonable price. For all that you want it for any model would probably do the trick, but if I was looking it would be for a Cat or Austin Western. Tough old graders and last forever. If you find one it would be a good idea to take someone with grader experience to check it out for you.
As far as running one effectively, that takes a lot of practice. You have 3 miles of road so just take your time, have fun and learn. :)
 

curly

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 4, 2008
Messages
220
Location
Sioux Falls,SD
Occupation
loader operator
I'm new to motor graders and while the controls are initially daunting you can remember pretty quick which ones you'll use the most. The hard part for me is figuring out when the blade is level. For a road you should be pretty well off with the grader.
 

skyhightree1

Active Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2008
Messages
33
Location
Richmond,Va
Occupation
Business Owner
Thanks for all your help... I am gonna try to pick up a oldie but goodie here at one of our construction equiptment auctions. That tractor and box blade is wearing me out...
 

F-1.08-F.G.

Active Member
Joined
Mar 17, 2008
Messages
27
Location
Richmond VA
Go for it

Hey, SkyHigh. Learning the basic functions of a grader is relatively easy... Unlike a dozer, loader or anything else that has it's tool in front of the machine, cutting the grade that you're about to travel on... a grader cuts relative to what the front tires are riding on (most of the time). I don't speak from much experince, but I've spent more than a couple hours on our CAT 12-G. I started from nothing, with no instruction, got in the grader, set the tips just above the ground, put it in second gear and BAM, I was a (very) rough blade hand. Maybe I make it sound a little easier than it really was... but it doesn't sound like you'll articulating around manholes and valve boxes and what-not. So although my opinion my not be worth much, I'd say invest in healthy 12 and have fun learning. Once you get over the nervousness and your hands remember the basic functions (all the front-line controls) you'll see where all the fun is. NOTHING is as fun as being the last person to touch the surface before they cover your work in hot, black, sticky gravel.
 

skyhightree1

Active Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2008
Messages
33
Location
Richmond,Va
Occupation
Business Owner
Thanks I will try that soon as i get one... but i know I wont be using that tractor and box blade anymore
 

Deas Plant

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
Messages
1,533
Location
Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
The art of grader operation.

Hi, Skyhightree1.
The whole art of operating a grader, or indeed any earthmoving machine is in setting the blade/cutting edge to take the material from where you want to take it to where you want to place it in the least number of passes. A grader is more of an instrument than a machine in that it does finer work than most other machines and can be set so many different ways for different jobs.

Not a lot of people realise that a grader does most of the work for you if you set the blade right and let it do its thing. Graders work very much on the law of the lever. If one front wheel goes over a windrow a foot high, by the time that movement at the wheel is transferred to the centre of the front axle, it is reduced to a 6" movement by the lever action of the axle. The movement is halved again by the time it gets to the blade because the blade is around halfway along the main frame to the tandem pivot. So, if you DON'T touch the controls at all as that front wheel goes over that foot high windrow, the blade will only lift 3" in the middle.

If you make another pass in that same track, again without touching any controls, you will be hard pressed to find where the blade rose at all.

Grader4me nailed it pretty well when he said either Cat or Austin-Western but there were a couple of smaller graders that would do the job pretty well too and you may pick one of them up for beer change or not much more. They were the Galion 503 and the Allis Chalmers DD. Also, a John Deere 570 is a pretty reliable smaller grader, roughly 1/2 way between the Galion/Allis and the early Cat 12's in size and power. Ideally. I would be looking for an early Cat 12, Cat 112 or Cat 212. These are in descending order of size. All will 'gitter dunn'. It's just that the smaller ones take longer to do it. Cats will demand the biggest bank account to purchase and possibly the smallest to run.

If you have any questions at all, please do not hesitate to ask, either in this thread or in a new one.
 

JDOFMEMI

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 3, 2007
Messages
3,074
Location
SoCal
The best advice with a grader for a beginner is to remember that the grader is designed to make smoothing the path easy. Once you get the blade on the ground, you can NEARLY leave it alone, but for a minor adjustment here and there, and let the machine do the work.
The number of levers can look daunting, but once you set the angle where you want for a pass, you only need to worry about up and down for each side. Thats only 2 levers to worry about. When you get the basic operation down, then worry about the other ones.

An older Cat would be good, as they last a long time, and parts are easy to come by when needed. You may also find a cheap deal on an older Champion

Good luck and Good blading

On Edit:
As I typed my response, Deas summed up the reason a grader is easy much better than I.
 
Last edited:

buggyman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2008
Messages
60
Location
Annex, OR
Occupation
Kingsbury Grading
Cat 12 8t

Hi Deas

I just got a 1953 CAT 12 8T and I would like to call and pick your brain. I have a parts manual but I've not found an operator’s manual/service manual yet. I'm just guessing on how to set everything. If you could email me I'll call when it's convenient for you. I’m in Bend Oregon, USA! sweethomewindshield@yahoo.com Thanks, Paul Kingsbury the Buggyman…

Hi, Skyhightree1.
The whole art of operating a grader, or indeed any earthmoving machine is in setting the blade/cutting edge to take the material from where you want to take it to where you want to place it in the least number of passes. A grader is more of an instrument than a machine in that it does finer work than most other machines and can be set so many different ways for different jobs.

Not a lot of people realise that a grader does most of the work for you if you set the blade right and let it do its thing. Graders work very much on the law of the lever. If one front wheel goes over a windrow a foot high, by the time that movement at the wheel is transferred to the centre of the front axle, it is reduced to a 6" movement by the lever action of the axle. The movement is halved again by the time it gets to the blade because the blade is around halfway along the main frame to the tandem pivot. So, if you DON'T touch the controls at all as that front wheel goes over that foot high windrow, the blade will only lift 3" in the middle.

If you make another pass in that same track, again without touching any controls, you will be hard pressed to find where the blade rose at all.

Grader4me nailed it pretty well when he said either Cat or Austin-Western but there were a couple of smaller graders that would do the job pretty well too and you may pick one of them up for beer change or not much more. They were the Galion 503 and the Allis Chalmers DD. Also, a John Deere 570 is a pretty reliable smaller grader, roughly 1/2 way between the Galion/Allis and the early Cat 12's in size and power. Ideally. I would be looking for an early Cat 12, Cat 112 or Cat 212. These are in descending order of size. All will 'gitter dunn'. It's just that the smaller ones take longer to do it. Cats will demand the biggest bank account to purchase and possibly the smallest to run.

If you have any questions at all, please do not hesitate to ask, either in this thread or in a new one.
 

skyhightree1

Active Member
Joined
Sep 18, 2008
Messages
33
Location
Richmond,Va
Occupation
Business Owner
Thanks... I appreciate all you your suggestions.... I will definately let yall know what I buy... Is there anything I need to look at when buying a motor grader is there something I need to be aware of ?
 

Deas Plant

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
Messages
1,533
Location
Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
Pickin' me brains??????????????????

Hi, Buggyman.
Welkum 2 ther 4um.

So yer wanna pick me brains? Wut makes yer think I've got enny? An' how 'bout if'n I need'em sometime in the future? LOL.

Somewhere in the Graders forum there is a post of mine with fairly detailed instructions for turning the blade lift bull gears (Hi-lift gears) and for adjusting the blade lift pinions that drive those gears.

I've just done a search and found one of the places where I've posted this information:

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.co...p=34454&highlight=grader+adjustment#post34454

See Post #29.

Further to the information in that post, you can also do a switch-around of the dog clutches in the control box so that you end up with less worn clutches on the blade lift control shafts. This DOES take a bit of brain work as you MUST keep correct track of which clutches are turning which way to do what so that you do get the less worn faces doing the work.

If you want/need further information, please feel free to e-mail me. Click on my name for my e-mail address. Or, if you have Yahoo Messenger and a suitable headset with microphone, we could talk for hours at little if any cost.
 

buggyman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2008
Messages
60
Location
Annex, OR
Occupation
Kingsbury Grading
Thanks Deas

I have read every post in the graders section... and found your recomendation for adjustments.

I just wondering how much slack/movement should there be in areas???

So far I can not see any of your information IE: email. I do not have permission :(

Anyway thanks...

Paul

Hi, Buggyman.
Welkum 2 ther 4um.

So yer wanna pick me brains? Wut makes yer think I've got enny? An' how 'bout if'n I need'em sometime in the future? LOL.

Somewhere in the Graders forum there is a post of mine with fairly detailed instructions for turning the blade lift bull gears (Hi-lift gears) and for adjusting the blade lift pinions that drive those gears.

I've just done a search and found one of the places where I've posted this information:

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.co...p=34454&highlight=grader+adjustment#post34454

See Post #29.

Further to the information in that post, you can also do a switch-around of the dog clutches in the control box so that you end up with less worn clutches on the blade lift control shafts. This DOES take a bit of brain work as you MUST keep correct track of which clutches are turning which way to do what so that you do get the less worn faces doing the work.

If you want/need further information, please feel free to e-mail me. Click on my name for my e-mail address. Or, if you have Yahoo Messenger and a suitable headset with microphone, we could talk for hours at little if any cost.
 

taz

New Member
Joined
Dec 10, 2007
Messages
4
Location
amarillo tx
smoothing a road to ur house wouldnt be to hard to learn how to do take some time and mistakes but u can figure it out... maybe... on the other hand cutting blue to tops to grade over 1500 or 2000 ft. at a time with no segregation and making a smooth ride for the state inspectors who drive over ur land at 70 mph is a different story takes years of practice and special kind of person some can never get it...
 

Deas Plant

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
Messages
1,533
Location
Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
How much slack?

Hi, Buggyman.
When those old girls came new fresh out of the factory, they had JUST enough clearance ine th ball joints to allow them to turn without binding, so little that you could not see it. The blade lift gears all meshed perfectly and the dog clutches in the control box ONLY kicked back under EXTREME load - you were more likely to shear a shear pin in the vertical drive shaft to the control box/ The front lean wheels did NOT flop all over the place and the steering DIDN'T have a turn and a half slack. LOL.

I believe there is a German word to describe how tight they were:

"SCHNIEZENTITE".

From there it was a long, SLOW progression to 3 or 4 inches of 'stump-jump and the blade and a severe case of wanderlust in the front end. The good part about it was that it DID take a long time and a LOT of work to wear much slack into them.

The more of that slack you can remove without causing anything to bind up, the better.

Hope this helps.
 

buggyman

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 16, 2008
Messages
60
Location
Annex, OR
Occupation
Kingsbury Grading
Thanks Deas!

Hey, this is just want I was wondering. I've taken most of the slack out of everything; there is about 1 1/2" of movement/slack on the end of the blade. I was thinking about shimming the circle shoes, there is between 1/8" and 1/4" space which lets the circle move up and down. Do you think I should take this slack out too?
The old 12 8T shows 2946 hours on the engine. I'm kind of thinking this is original hours. Many things are in really good shape but some things have worn quite a bit. It's on the second set of tires, this set has about 75% tread left; they were put on 10 - 15 years ago.
I received an operator’s manual "new reprint" from Yesterdays Tractor; good thing too; I found many hidden places for grease and oil :)
I’ve rebuilt the heater, it has one motor and was placed on the floor under the gauges, and I don’t really like it there, and was thinking about putting it to the right side of where you sit on the rear of the cab. Any suggestions on where to mount the heater?
Well thanks again!
Paul
 

Deas Plant

Senior Member
Joined
Jan 21, 2006
Messages
1,533
Location
Gold Coast, Queensland, Australia
Shimming circle

Hi, Paul.
There were originally shims under the circle guides to cater for thw wear you mentioned. If the are all gone, put the blade on the ground - preferably on concrete - square across the machine and put just a little weight on it. Then check the thickness of the circle ring - where the teeth are - at several points around the circle, including in the center at the back and note these thicknesses down on paper.

Next, see what thickness of steel plate - or feeler guages - you can slide between each circle guide and the underside of the circle and note these down on paper too. Now compare the circle thicknesses and the plate thicknesses to see what would be the maximum thickness of plate you could put on each circle guide so that the circle will still clear all the way around. Then cut appropriate thickness plates to shape and weld them onto the wear faces of each circle guide.

Alternatively, you can simply weld say 1/4" plate on all the circle guide wear faces and then shim each guide so that it has clearance to pass the thickest part of the circle.

You may note that there are adjusting bolts - or that there WERE adjusting bolts, as they have a habit of getting broken off - on each circle guide to set the guides to hold the circle in correct mesh with the circle drive pinion. Make sure that these are all there and correctly adjusted so the the circle is meshing correctly with the pinion.

I've never had an older Cat 12 with a heater. Remember, I live DownUnder where we seldom get snow or ice. LOL.

Hope this helps. Good stuff on the manual.
 
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