D6c cat loss of oil pressure

[Hobbytime]

whats the dozer worth in good running condition in todays market?

 

[thepumpguysc]

So they "ran it" & it didn't overheat?? if not, then why do they need a rad?? OH that's right, the gauges didn't work..
This just keeps getting better.. so to speak..
THEY f'd up & that's all there is to it..
So either it was a lack of lube that caused the problem or was it the radiator, that they didn't watch the gauges on OR shoot it w/ a temp gun.. while they were test running it..
Heck.. when I test run a customers engine, I compare the temp gauges WITH a temp GUN..
THAT WAY I can tell the customer about his machines gauge..

 

[Steve.ahlgren85]

I have been told that if you can find one for under $20,000,you're lucky.

 

[Vetech63]

and I thought this couldn't get any worse?!

 

[Wes J]

You need a lawyer. I can't believe the slack you have cut them so far.

 

[kshansen]

Camshaft has been damaged, lifters also worn badly due to the lack of lubrication from rocker assembly mistake.

You mean they rebuilt the engine after you had brought it to them for what has to be the second failure, as the initial failure was the one that started this whole store at posting #1, and they rebuilt it and did not correct the problem with the "claimed to be rocker problem". If that is what you are saying then any problem that cam about from this far fetched story is on them. They know the engine had been messed with by an untrained person. They should have made 110% sure every part they touched was correct for the application.

I know you are not a mechanic but the story seems to change every time something is posted about this engine. Until someone can prove to me that this story about a mismatch between the rocker assembly could cause the oil pressure to be so low as to cause a major failure in only an hour and half or so of running I'm sticking with the BS claim on that one.

Did they even check the oil pressure while they had it running to do this claimed stall test? If the pressure was indeed below spec's they should have noticed that in the first few seconds of running it and immediately shut it down to find the problem!

Just in case this dealer doesn't know how to check oil pressure here is the chart off SIS:

Note that this are MINIMUM PERMISSIBLE PRESSURES! I would personally start to panic if, after warming up even slightly, on an engine I had worked on the oil pressure at anything over 1,000 RPM that was less than 60 PSI!

I would ask them for the test run sheet on the engine that shows the oil pressure, temperature, RPMs, and if they were serious the Boost Pressure and RPM at convert stall, hydraulic stall and then full stall. If they can't or won't give you that information be sure your lawyer makes full mention of that when he talks to the judge. If they did not make note of those things they are in my mind guilty of malpractice.
It would be like a doctor doing a heart transplant and not checking you blood pressure or pulse!

And if they come out with the story "The gauges on the dash read good" get that in writing because they had no way of knowing if they were accurate with out comparing the readings to a known good gauge.

 

[Welder Dave]

I don't look at this as caterpillar trying to run up the bill, They are offering to buy my machine ,deduct the buyout price of $4,000 from the original bill. That is one option that they gave me. Second option was to put the machine back together, bare bones ,deduct the transport costs,deduct the labor charge but I would still have to pay for parts going in,repairs on the head, gaskets, and radiator inspection and reassemble. That part I can understand as being my responsibility,but still out some money .#3option ist


Their response to that is,we don't have any way of testing the engine under a load here. I posed that question to them. They did the stall test .ran it outside for a couple of hours, they said ,everything looked fine.

So what did they do... let it sit outside idling for a couple hours??? That's about the worst thing for a rebuilt engine but could explain why it didn't overheat on them. LoL I had a Hino diesel truck and it could idle all day and the temp. gauge would barely move. Get driving it and it could cook you out in 15 minutes. Steve you need to dismiss EVERYTHING they are telling you! There are just feeding you a continuous load of total BS trying to manipulate and confuse you. I think it's working. The only thing you want to hear from them is that they are going to fix your machine for the money you paid for them to do exactly that. The fact the rocker assembly wasn't right should have been a clue to 99.99% percent of mechanics that they should thoroughly check EVERYTHING to do with the engine!

 

[Junkyard]

If they used their own equipment they'd have this hooked up while they checked it over and made sure it was ok.....


Idk about y'all but when I'm starting a new motor I'm super sensitive to noises, smells, vibration etc. I even go as far as running them without valve covers to make sure it's all oiling properly etc. I don't let one leave my shop until it's been heat cycled a couple times, head/s retorqued if necessary, lash checked and I usually sacrifice an oil filter just to be sure. I damn sure don't want one coming back to me!!! Back in the day I'd set my hydraulic lifter valve lash on a SBC by feel as it ran. Then I got serious and it was all solid lifter from there . That was before roller lifters became so common.

 

[Steve.ahlgren85]

A guy from cat corporate called today, admitting that they should have checked out the radiator more thoroughly ,that the radiator being plugged was probably the problem from the very first startup. They are admitting mistakes as I am .So where do we go from here was my question?They have agreed to install and cover the costs involved for the parts. My responsibility would be recore radiator, installation costs,and parts to replace camshaft and lifters, plus the original bill,or to forfeit the machine to them with a $0.00 balance.

 

[51kw]

That still stinks, but it is $4000 better than the first offer.

 

[td25c]

Back in the day I'd set my hydraulic lifter valve lash on a SBC by feel as it ran. Then I got serious and it was all solid lifter from there . That was before roller lifters became so common.

I'm the same way ... Run solid lifter roller cams & superchargers on most of my iron ...... Anymore a feller needs every advantage he can get .

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/threads/old-hy-hoe.8220/page-9#post-738435

If Steve's Cat D6 came in to our shop and we could not sort out the Cat engine trouble it would leave with a Detroit 4-71 under the hood .

 

[RZucker]

I'm the same way ... Run solid lifter roller cams & superchargers on most of my iron ...... Anymore a feller needs every advantage he can get .

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/threads/old-hy-hoe.8220/page-9#post-73

If Steve's Cat D6 came in to our shop and we could not sort out the Cat engine trouble it would leave with a Detroit 4-71 under the hood .

Personally, I would jam a 6-71 in there.

 

[Junkyard]

Personally, I would jam a 6-71 in there.

I've got a fresh 8v71.....

 

[td25c]

Go easy fellers .... We don't want to tare the D6 Cat up .


Cat D 6 C early 70's machine 160 horse power range ?

I'm an International / Fiat - Allis guy . Hard to keep up on the off brand machines .

 

[Junkyard]

It's not turbo so the most it'll go is 318.... it'll be fine

 

[RZucker]

Go easy fellers .... We don't want to tare the D6 Cat up .


Cat D 6 C early 70's machine 160 horse power range ?

I'm an International / Fiat - Allis guy . Hard to keep up on the off brand machines .

N50's in a 6-71 would be close... we can paint it green and call it an 82 -20.

 

[RZucker]

It's not turbo so the most it'll go is 318.... it'll be fine

That would make it an 82-40 if it was green.

 

[Hobbytime]

A guy from cat corporate called today, admitting that they should have checked out the radiator more thoroughly ,that the radiator being plugged was probably the problem from the very first startup. They are admitting mistakes as I am .So where do we go from here was my question?They have agreed to install and cover the costs involved for the parts. My responsibility would be recore radiator, installation costs,and parts to replace camshaft and lifters, plus the original bill,or to forfeit the machine to them with a $0.00 balance.

you should have a good running dozer at their expense at this point, I would think you paying for new radiator and any labor on that fair, as if the motor didnt cook and they found the real issue, you would be paying for the radiator and costs anyway..but you paid for a rebuilt engine at a cat dealer and thats what you should have at no additional costs for the engine part, plus the radiator and related expenses..thats fair..

 

[Wes J]

the radiator being plugged was probably the problem from the very first startup.

They have agreed to install and cover the costs involved for the parts. My responsibility would be recore radiator, installation costs,and parts to replace camshaft and lifters, plus the original bill,or to forfeit the machine to them with a $0.00 balance.

Finally. Someone is finally making sense.

I don't see how you could do much better than that. They basically offered to wipe the slate clean and start over. I think that's a fair offer.

 

[Welder Dave]

Lets get back on track. Steve, first thing you need to do is stop admitting you made mistakes. You did initially but once it went to the dealer it was up to them to diagnose the problem and repair your machine. That's what you paid them for. The only thing you should be admitting fault for was trusting the Cat dealer to fix your machine. They are supposed to have the expertise and all the special tools like Junkyard posted. They still owe you a proper running machine. Cat corporate covering $4K makes me think they know the dealer screwed up. The dealer should be covering the rest. The dealer screwed up royally and are scrambling to try and get out of it. Keep the pressure on and don't back down. You've got them rethinking their position. Just this thread should arm your lawyer with more than enough proof they cut a lot of corners. If they fixed everything except the rad, at the very least you should get a discount on a re-cored rad (they most likely get a discount at the rad shop) and they should cover the labour for the extreme length of time they have had your machine. They should also deliver it no charge because if they had properly diagnosed it and fixed it in the 1st place, they wouldn't have to haul it back and forth. Their time is worth $100/hr.+. Your time, downtime and frustration is worth something too!