southernman13
Senior Member
Oh hell yeah hopefully your troubles will come to an end. Bout damn time. I'm tired of you workin on it hehe!! Hope that fixes it. Your gonna have to change your name to vcase!!!
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Case 850K won't move foward or reverse
- Thread starter vcat
- Start date
GaryHoff
Senior Member
Good to hear. Hopefully this will be the last of your issues.
guisep3
Well-Known Member
I tried to take my joystick to my local dealer and they said they wouldn't touch it. Glad to hear you found a dealer willing to help!
guisep3
Well-Known Member
Vcat I wanted to give you an update on my situation seeing as how we have nearly identical symptoms and error codes. I hired a mechanic that helped me double team the diagnostics that Garyhoff has walked you thru. We walked thru the manual that I bought from the dealer and we found an error in the print. I called my dealer and even the shop foreman agreed that the book was wrong. We checked for continuity between pins 5 and 6 with the stick in neutral position as instructed. The result on my old and NEW joystick was identical which was an OPEN. L, R, F, R all gave a closed circuit which makes sense. According to the book it says you should see closed. If you see open circuit the book says the joystick is bad. What does your stick give you?
I then proceeded to follow all the instructions to test the 4533, 4532, and 4531 diagnostics. All my readings checked ok. The book says if found ok, then the Travel Control Module is bad. Im already $2300 deep on a joystick to this point, so Im desperate to find any solution. So my mechanic and I pulled the 1 amp fuses that are used for the travel control module. (1amp, 1amp, and a 25amp.) I found a blown 1 amp fuse on the controller, so we replaced it with a 3 amp. I turned the key back on and sure enough the tranny error light had gone out. So I put my old joystick back in machine and was able to operate the machine again. My advice would be to try a 3 amp fuse in place of the 1 amp fuse. as your looking at that row it would be the 3 fuse from the left.
let me know how your situation works out, Im on schedule for a Mobile Service call from dealer to plug in computer. I might wait and run the machine for a while to see what happens.
vcat
Well-Known Member
IT MOVES! Yep, ain't that cool? GaryHoff you nailed it. I appreciate the help. New joystick did the trick. It is certainly a relief to have the problem solved.
GaryHoff, I do indeed appreciate the step by step trouble shooting, for someone who really enjoys heavy equipment but is not a mechanic. I hope that is all the problems for a
while. I know I do have one but it is not an immediate issue. Its probably a winter shop repair. The seal on the drive shaft behind the u-joint where it goes into the big pump
appears to have a small leak. This is what soaked the throttle pot. The spinning u-joint throws the fluid in a big circle. The leak is not big but I'm sure it will grow with use. Is it
possible to unbolt the pump and slide it back or does the pump need to be pulled? Either way the seal will have to be changed out.
I appreciate the comments, support and humor from everyone. I am ready to button her up an get back to clearing brush.
GaryHoff, I do indeed appreciate the step by step trouble shooting, for someone who really enjoys heavy equipment but is not a mechanic. I hope that is all the problems for a
while. I know I do have one but it is not an immediate issue. Its probably a winter shop repair. The seal on the drive shaft behind the u-joint where it goes into the big pump
appears to have a small leak. This is what soaked the throttle pot. The spinning u-joint throws the fluid in a big circle. The leak is not big but I'm sure it will grow with use. Is it
possible to unbolt the pump and slide it back or does the pump need to be pulled? Either way the seal will have to be changed out.
I appreciate the comments, support and humor from everyone. I am ready to button her up an get back to clearing brush.
GaryHoff
Senior Member
Good to hear its working. It was a bit of a trip to come to the conclusion, but I do enjoy the puzzle.
The shaft seal into the pump is expensive, at least $100 or so. Its a Rexroth pump, so you can probably get one at your local hydraulic shop for less, just make sure they don't give you a standard lip seal. Needs to be the special seal to handle the case drain pressure.
I think that you can slide the pump back to install the new seal, but you would be cramped for room. It would be easier to install the seal with the pump being vertical, or removed from the machine.
The shaft seal into the pump is expensive, at least $100 or so. Its a Rexroth pump, so you can probably get one at your local hydraulic shop for less, just make sure they don't give you a standard lip seal. Needs to be the special seal to handle the case drain pressure.
I think that you can slide the pump back to install the new seal, but you would be cramped for room. It would be easier to install the seal with the pump being vertical, or removed from the machine.
vcat
Well-Known Member
Thanks for all the help GaryHoff.
Hi guys,,,I have a 850K Series 2,1600 hours, stuck in low gear,so here I am. I just want to thank the heck out of Gary for the superior knowledge and patience,you are a hero here. Vcat for your perseverance and posts. And Guisep3, I strongly wonder if I owned that dozer for a few days before you. I had bought a DC85 from a family farm equipment dealer North of Pittsburg about an hour? Extremely religious!!! Got it here and it wouldn't push anything,looked great and drove,wouldn't push a thing,and he returned it and refunded me. I will go start a new thread,I just wanted to REALLY thank everyone in this thread,,,some super great stuff. Have a great day guys,and thank you.
All,
Got involved with one of these machines that had a joystick problem. Dozer would not move in forward or reverse without keeping pressure on the stick in a VERY particular spot. I opened the joystick and determined the potentiometers for F/R and L/R had failed. I have the ability to get these components custom made to match the originals and can perform the repair for a fraction of the cost of a new joystick. Is this something useful? What other machines use the same joystick?
Right now, I'm thinking I could charge somewhere around $750 for a repair. If i decide it is worth it, i will have a larger quantity of components made to keep on hand. I am located in SW Ohio.
Got involved with one of these machines that had a joystick problem. Dozer would not move in forward or reverse without keeping pressure on the stick in a VERY particular spot. I opened the joystick and determined the potentiometers for F/R and L/R had failed. I have the ability to get these components custom made to match the originals and can perform the repair for a fraction of the cost of a new joystick. Is this something useful? What other machines use the same joystick?
Right now, I'm thinking I could charge somewhere around $750 for a repair. If i decide it is worth it, i will have a larger quantity of components made to keep on hand. I am located in SW Ohio.
Bush , I followed this thread earlier. I can offer this info , which you may already know. From the machines I've ran all the K models use the same joystick , 650 up to 1850. Cat , Deere and Komatsu all use about the same set up. I have a Komatsu D39 which is the counter part to the 850 Case. I will see if I can lay my hands on a Komatsu stick to see if you can repair these as well. 750 would be reasonable , I think a new one is 2200 or more. Gary Hoff that posted here is very knowledgeable of Case equipment.
Thanks! That would be great. I need to document the machines that use the same stick. From the stick that I've been working on, i can't imagine much else going wrong with them other than the microswitches. If a board component fails, i might not be able to fix it, although I would give it a shot. I just don't have the details of the machine connections to be able to test the whole stick.
Honestly,mine is still a doorstop. 4 family members with health issues really limits a guy on what he can get done outside. My very next step was to do exactly this. Pull the joystick, bring it inside,sit it by the fire all nice and dry for days and tear into it. Nothing to lose. Last I checked with Case. New one was $2050 and discontinued. Reman was $1400. I had found a new one on a shelf for $1450 and was going to buy it but just couldn't pull the trigger until I checked mine out for peace of mind. Bush,,, there is absolutely a market for rebuilding these. No question about that.Like everything else, price is what sells. And it will have to be right.
1700 hours. All was fine. Some big talker stopped in, they were doing a paving job down the road and someone told him I would probably take the tear out for in my driveway. He was the boss, he obviously had machine experience,said he had 34 years and his daughter could out operate most guys.... He said he had to own it, wanted his boss to buy it. I said sure, you can level the loads as they come up,and you will know EXACTLY what you're buying, keys are in it... Well, 15 minutes later, the guy with him comes back up, how do you get that to move.? We walked down and he didn't know to put both parking brakes down. He had rared on it not knowing how to get it to move and it's been stuck in first gear ever since. As of right now, there are no codes, Case dealer I called had me read them to him, then we erased them,and a line blew,in the middle of the biggest flood we have ever had,and it's been down since. It goes F and R, but very very slow. Turns fine. The line that blew calls for the blade and frame to be pulled off , I sawzalled it off, got a swivel that lacks literally 1 mm of going in,and haven't been back to it... I really need to get this beast up and around...If I pull it off and can't see anything obvious like dirty rusty components... I could send it to you for a experiment I suppose. I was thinking along the exact same lines you were. I was gonna source parts and do my damndest to rebuild it
. Just the kinda guy I am. But you are ahead of me, I will gladly help anyway I can. I have a pond and 1/4 mile of creek to clean this spring. I'm already permitted from the flood damage.I checked the wiring, it is spotless clean,and all the connectors are soft and supple. The joystick feels perfect, detents and returns as new. It just won't go fast
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When you say "stuck in first gear," is that first speed on the thumb switches? I read somewhere that the dealer can get you those parts. When you say "turns fine," does it turn at the full speed or same speed as it moves forward and reverse. Will it counter-rotate when the stick is full left or right?
Man, I apologize, I'm used to being the mechanic,boy do i stink at being the customer... It shifts through all of the gears up and down perfectly in the dash. The thumb rocker works perfect. Also, it is not "stuck" in first gear,iirc,, it does not move in 1,2,3,starts to move in 4th and gets ever so slightly faster in 5 and 6. Is it a 6 speed on the thumb lol? I forget but think it is. Yes, it countersteers in reverse,and steers fine,but does not speed up at all.In a nustshell, all is well except that 1-3 are static,and 3-6 barely make the machine move,but ARE different, the rocker switch for the thumb is doing it's job. Whew ...lol.
Sounds like it could be a problem with the forward/reverse pot, just like the one i've been working on, except his would jerk in and out of gear. I believe it is 5 speeds on the thumb. Starts at 60%, can step it up to 100%. Let me know if you want to pursue a repair. I haven't ordered any pots yet and they're 10-12 week lead time.
GaryHoff
Senior Member
Hello everyone, good to see this thread is getting some use.
atc007, Just my 2 cents on your issue:
The hydrostatic transmission is pump adjusted from speeds 1-6. At speed 6 the pump is at full stroke. From speeds 7-10, the speeds are adjusted by the motor displacement.
Failed joysticks typically will set active fault codes.
Your brake POT is working? Have you calibrated it?
Some machines will not move at too low of an idle. I'm assuming your checking all of this at 1/3 throttle or more.
Does the machine counter rotate normally? Do the tracks speed up when you counter rotate, compared to straight travel?
I would recommend checking your charge pressure. There is test ports on the side of the machine. Also have a close look at your brake POT.
atc007, Just my 2 cents on your issue:
The hydrostatic transmission is pump adjusted from speeds 1-6. At speed 6 the pump is at full stroke. From speeds 7-10, the speeds are adjusted by the motor displacement.
Failed joysticks typically will set active fault codes.
Your brake POT is working? Have you calibrated it?
Some machines will not move at too low of an idle. I'm assuming your checking all of this at 1/3 throttle or more.
Does the machine counter rotate normally? Do the tracks speed up when you counter rotate, compared to straight travel?
I would recommend checking your charge pressure. There is test ports on the side of the machine. Also have a close look at your brake POT.
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Bush and Gary. Thank you so much for responding. I didn't get a email alert that you had?? I'm still down with the blown hose . Once up and running I will get you fellas specifics! Gary, it does counterrotate correctly,even though it is super slow, it is doing that. Yes, I know it has to have rpm's to operate. I have owned it for a few years. How would I go about checking the brake pot,and what and where is it lol.I don't have a hydraulic pressure gauge but will acquire one if needed.
. Once up and running I will get you fellas specifics! Gary, it does counterrotate correctly,even though it is super slow, it is doing that. Yes, I know it has to have rpm's to operate. I have owned it for a few years. How would I go about checking the brake pot,and what and where is it lol.I don't have a hydraulic pressure gauge but will acquire one if needed.
GaryHoff
Senior Member
Please see page 3 of this thread, in regards to the brake POT.