pond cleanout methods

[JBGASH]

What methods do everyone use to clean out existing ponds that have silted in? I have a customer that has 2- ponds that have a couple feet of water and full of silt. I have cut the dams to drain the water and let them dry and will either use an excavator and a dozer or trackloader to remove the silt as long as we can get in it or if that won't work will get/rent a long reach excavator and try it that way. Just wondering if there are other methods or any advice anyone would like to add to get this project done...

 

[norite]

Have you considered a dragline?

 

[Scrub Puller]

Yair . . . JBGASH As I have mentioned on here many times silt scoops are effective and simple to make. I think Pedrick are overstating the HP requirements.

http://www.pederickengineering.com.au/ScoopsRippers.php

It is very small but this is the only link I can find to a unit in operation. Infinitely better I believe than putting a machine down in that crap.

http://ktsfarmlife.blogspot.com.au/2013/01/its-all-about-water.html

In the "old days" all the stations had a silt scoop or two and they were operated by horse teams . . . tanks or dams as we call them were cleaned out on a regular basis.

Cheers.

 

[JBGASH]

Scrub, I will look into that scoop method.
Norite, I have a couple of excavators and a trackloader, a dragline would be nice, but trying to use what I have to keep from renting if possible.

 

[Construct'O]

Depending on size so things vare from everyone.You will find most of them have a hard bottom under the silt.Unless there was an old ditch that didn't get cut out to bottom when pond was built.I usually take an bench out a place for the excavator to set on the dam the get a place started with the excavator down to bottom where it is clean to stsrt pushing with the dozer.

Then corner into the silt and start pushing up to to the excavator on the dam if reach isn't a problem then let the excavator operator swing it over the back.If i get a head of him then i start refacing the front slope of the dam with the clean clay bottom where the silt was.All the silt needs to be out before you reface the dam.Might have to back up farther to get extra dirt to reface also.

Start across the dam flipping from cleaning silt to refacing and making top wider again because of cows narrow up the bam over the years.If silt is deep in the middile might have to start again on the other side then work back to the middle.

Sometime have just cut a big opening in the middle enough that you can push silt through the slot,but need to work togather with the ecavator getting a path dug through the silt so the dozer can have a clean path to run in.Sounds all good and well ,but things can turn to crap fast.Main thing is trying to corner in with half blade because silt will running around blade a lot of the time.

Will have to use the pie pattern at times to get done what you need to do.If all else push out to the sides and the move it again up to the bank to be move over the back.Or push out of the water line to dry and spread later. It's fun (cough,cough!!!)Good luck

 

[Construct'O]

Use a ditch cleaning bucket if you can, makes life easier.60" Baldson here.Water silt runs around the smaller bucket a lot and the ditch cleaning bucket leaves less of this problem.Again good luck

 

[buckfever]

We are cleaning out a silt pond in a housing development right now that hase about 7 feet of the nastiest mud you could imagine. To start with all the mud on our job has to be hauled away so we are just dumping it over the other side and pushing it ( if chasing windrows of pee soup is pushing) into a pile to be hauled out. To get the mud out right now we are taking a excavator and walking into the pond bottom and tossing the mud into a corner then getting ontop of the dam and throughing it out. Once we get enought area opened up will start feeding the excavator with a dozer but for right now it's just slow going.

 

[powerjoke]

We do more than I can count every year and we do everyone of them with a crawler loader ....... Best way I found is to bail off in them with a 963 and start packing muck out, however plan on going through a set of rails in 2500hrs so charge a lot more than regular hourly rate

Pj

 

[Randy88]

I like to load it out as I go, whenever possible, I want to load and move the dirt to where it needs to end up right from the start, rather than shove it over the back and let it dry and then reload it later on, but it depends on where the dirt is going and how wet it is when its dug out. I use a dozer to shove the mud up an excavator so it can be loaded out into a scraper or what we're using to move it with.

 

[Dickjr.]

We usually just cut the dam and push water mud out through the cut. But you must stay on solid ground. Just use a dozer. We use a track loader if the mud can't run down hill behind the dam.

 

[EZ TRBO]

I've done it a number of different ways, and sometimes one way would not work at another pond due to size, bottom conditions etc. On one such pond that had a dam that had blown out years ago we were able to take an excavator in, cut a main trench and many branches and got it to drain, then pushed up onto the sides, dried out and then hauled into field with scraper. Another had natural springs throughout it and thought we could just get in with the excavator and bail twice and push with the dozer....started turning up blue clay which in our area indicates NO BOTTOM...spent 3 hours just trying to get the 312 back out..and was successful but needless to say I didn't go back in...ended up getting a long reach and bailed it out in about a weeks time(much quicker than I was doing with our own machine). Years ago I remember dad getting a swamp dozer and pushing a ton of muck out with that..don't recall the efficiency of that though.

No matter what, will be a challenge, good luck to you.

Trbo

 

[powerjoke]

We tried an excavator one time.....believe it or not my best hoe hand is the one that did this, to this day I don't know why he was going about it quite like this also hard to believe but it took a d5N and a 8wheel FWA tractor to get him outta there, luckily they were both setting on the job.... He shoulda stopped and called for help but he kept at it till it was to this point :beatsme

So after jumping his ass I was put on a de-muck job because the customer wanted to keep the water in the pond for cattle and I don't own a long reach,,,,,,, and well a pic is worth 1000words lol...... Oh and yeah I was responsible for the 200 mishap, but in my defense all was going well until the bottom gave away and she sunk to the cab and shorted out the pilot circuit, luckily the good folks at roadbuilders was working on Saturday and they talked me through bypassing the "lollipop" tree I woulda took better pics but I was kinda trapped on the machine with 20' of water all the way around and I dint feel like swimming just to take a pic

Pj

 

[FarmWrench]

Scrub: how is that rigged? Keeping the box upright must be a trick with deep silt?

 

[Scrub Puller]

Yair . . . FarmWrench.We just used a bridle and the height of the attachment point determined how hard they dig, they have some arrangement on that farm blog I don't quite understand.

One type rolls over or you can pull them back empty and take all the slop and mud out one way. This link shows a different type http://www.hoopersengineering.com/catalogue/scoops-0 . . .as you can see it's a pretty simple setup. The couple I made over the years were in fact two scoops welded back to back . . . some folks used to hook them back to back with chains.

There were once contractors that travelled around desilting on a full time basis. Their preferred method was by winch using a couple of ex military 4x4 Ford Blitz wagons or Studebaker/GMC 6x6's

This is a schematic as to how the scoops work which is similar to the Sauerman scrapers . . . think of a small tractor or a 4x4 pickup in place of the haulback http://www.ramseycoinc.com/

Cheers.

 

[dozerman400]

When possible I like to dig a hole next to the pond if you have decent dirt, deep as you can, put some silt in it about 1/2 way up and carefully cover it with the dry dirt with a track hoe evenly. Should harden up enough to drive on. Then haul the dry dirt away. I worked on many golf courses with this method.

 

[gwhammy]

I do them with a track loader. Cut a hole right in the middle of the dam and start cutting a slot up the middle being sure to keep down on solid clay. Once most of the way up the middle you have to be careful and start pushing down threw the slot. This works in the clay we have in northern Missouri real good. I try to reline the whole pond once done getting it clean. You just have to be careful with one machine. I really don't like doing it. Mud suks.

 

[razz]

I cleaned a pond out last year with a D8h and 435 But we were in a dought Only got stuck once when i let the tracks spin a little tomuch had to unhook the scraper to finally get out. What i would do is come across side ways loading in thrid gear its a 36a with the scraper about 4-6 inches deep then a got over half way across whould shift to 2 gear and finish filling the scraper. It was only hairy in the middle of the pond didnt want to spin or you whould be in trouble. Took out 2 feet.

 

[gwhammy]

The ones I've cleaned had 6 to 10 foot of mud in them. Had cattle running to them all their lives.

 

[HATCHEQUIP]

Ive done it in mud and water with mats and just keep throwing and piling behind and moving back and doing it over again until you can reach it from the bank. I think Ive seen what scrub calls a scoop some of the gravel pits up north use a saureman bucket that rides on cables from a machine that has 2 winches and goes across the pit to another machine that the cables are tied off to one cable holds the bucket at the desired height and the other cable pulls the bucket back and forth, wide pit just use longer cable

 

[JBGASH]

Powerjoke & gwhammy, do you cut the dam and let it drain a while (week or two) first before getting in it with the loader? Or do you bail right in it?

The ones I've cleaned had 6 to 10 foot of mud in them. Had cattle running to them all their lives.