two blown trailer tires today

[Jim Dandy]

I blew two front axle trailer tires today about 30 minutes apart. Do you guys think that having the loader too far forward is the problem? Thanks for your time.

 

[ricdel]

Not the expert but that is what I would say.
It is setting good and level so you must have a Big truck to handle the forward weight.

 

[Steve Frazier]

A couple questions come to mind, how long have you been moving the machine like that and have you had problems in the past? It does appear your tongue weight may be pretty high with the machine positioned like that, a trip to the scales would determine it for sure.

 

[Deere500a]

Trailer Tare wight +the loader are the trailer tires over loaded?

 

[Jim Dandy]

Thanks for all of your replys. I have had the loader for about 3 months but I have been hauling a Hitachi 160 trackhoe for 5 years or so. The 160 weighs more than the loader. I have had older tires blow over the past but that happened randomly. The tires that blew were both Kumhos about 2 years old. Do you guys have any recomendations on tire brand and number of plys.

 

[grandpa]

When you have a good load on that trailer, look between the duals and see how close the tires are together,,, maybe they are sagging and are rubbing against each other and creating some heat???? Just a thought. Gramps

 

[lumberjack]

We're the tires you blew on the same side?

 

[d9gdon]

The way I see it, it's transferring more of the weight to the truck the way you have it now. If you move it back, it would just make the trailer haul more of the weight which of course makes each tire carry more weight.

The equalizer on the axles should be making each tire carry the same amount either way you do it if I'm thinking right.

 

[Jim Dandy]

The tires were blown on each side of the trailer.

 

[Shenandoah]

When your trailer is on a severely crowned road, or an uneven surface, the tires are subjected to varying loads. This can cause one of the duals to carry substantially more weight than the other. If that weight exceeds the load carrying capacity of the tire, you're in trouble. The tire can handle it for a short time, but heat build up can cause rapid deterioration of the tire.

Your picture looks like the weight is too far forward in spite of any equalizer between the springs. And although this will increase the weight on the tongue it will still put huge stresses on the forward set of duals because they have to see the weight first in order to send it through the equalizer in a dynamic situation such as going down the road.

I'd find the highest ply tires you can reasonably afford and also check to make sure your rims are of the proper load rating for those plies. You have to match rim to tire, as I'm sure you're aware. And remember, if your air pressure drops below the prescribed PSI the load carrying capacity of the tire will diminish correspondingly. One good pot hole and the road can kiss the rim destroying the tire.

It would also be a good idea to run the rig over a set of scales to see where the load is actually carried.

 

[06Pete]

I haul my 953 further foreward but that puts more weight on the hitch. I use Michilin on mine and have'nt had any trouble moveing my 315 and 953 behind a single axle. Were they inside tires or outside, properly inflated, did they have clearence on top, did you have any that could have been stuck between them like rocks. I would bet they were not over loaded but were prevously damaged or just poor tires. How old were the tires by the dot date they could have been old stock you were sold. Also how fast were you pulling it as the higher the speed the lower the rating I know that Eager Beaver trailers are rated at 55 MPH I dont know the rating on the tires.

 

[Delmer]

Any reason to suspect a nail in the tire or another cause for low inflation?

 

[brianbulldozer]

I am interested in knowing more about the 160 you haul with the same trailer. Around here, excavators are commonly equipped with some or all of the following: quick couplers, hydraulic link thumbs, long sticks, long and wide undercarriage, catwalks, circle guarding, hardened rear doors, extra counterweight, etc.. With a base weight of 36,000 to 39,000 lb (depending on make and series), a fully equipped 160 can be over 40,000 lbs pretty easily. In Washington we are only allowed 34,000 lbs on a set of tandem duals with normal axle spacing. I can't recall seeing anyone local hauling a 150-160 size excavator on anything less than a three axle trailer in years. Back in the day before every town and county around here had commercial vehicle enforcement officers, you might see a 150-160 on a two axle trailer, but the trailer would typically be a tilt deck with the low profile 22.5 rubber. Does VA allow more weight on the trailer axles? If so, could you be exceeding the load limit on your tires (looks to be approx 4500 lbs/tire) if you have the 215/75 R17.5 tires that Eager Beaver specs for that trailer? Switching to the 235/75 R17.5 would give you quite a bit more capacity, if that is an option. I know you said that you haven't had problems hauling the 160 the last 5 years, but could it be that you have been lucky?

 

[Shenandoah]

Does VA allow more weight on the trailer axles?

Page 3 tells the story...

http://www.dmv.state.va.us/webdoc/pdf/dmv109.pdf

 

[Jim Dandy]

Once again thanks for all the replys. Shenandoah I checked the air pressure a couple of weeks ago and don't think they lost any air. The tires were 16 ply and I had trouble finding tires with more plys. Brian is right in that the tires are rated at 4540 lbs. The bigger tires with a 5000 or so rating where taller and wider and I was concerned about clearance between the tire and the trailer. 06 Pete also has a good point about the rating is for 55mph and I was going 65-70. I will now load the loader and then raise the ramps and then back the loader up to the ramps. I went back with Dyna Track tires which the tire guy recommended. We'll see. a decent used triple axle with hydraulic ramps might be in my future. I will keep the forum posted.

 

[Shenandoah]

I checked the air pressure a couple of weeks ago and don't think they lost any air.

Jim, I had a chuckle when I read that only because I had an 'episode' last fall where I fell prey to the same line of thinking. Before I left on a four and a half hour drive to pick up something I looked everywhere for my tire gauge and couldn't find it. So naturally that meant the tires had the proper air pressure. They didn't, but with the trailer empty they sure looked good and I didn't thump them, either.

So when I get to the loading location it turns out the item was WAY heavier than I was led to believe and was in fact too heavy for my little crane to load. Luckily the yard foreman said they had two forklifts and if they lifted from both sides I could back my trailer underneath the load while they held it up. So I did.

As they were lowering the load onto my trailer I watched in horror as my tires started to flatten. I was thinking, "Good Lord, how heavy is this thing anyway!?!" Then it occurred to me I might not have looked in the cab for the tire gauge, and low and behold that's where that dang thing was hiding.

I was very relieved to find it was a low air pressure problem that could be easily fixed as opposed to a severely overloaded condition being that far from home. I have no doubt I maxed the trailer out, but being low on air pressure was the last thing on my mind. Lesson learned. There's a reason you need to do those pesky pre-trip inspections. Even if you've gone years without an incident.

On another note...going as fast as you were going would have created enough heat to make an iffy situation a bad one for your tires. The heat in the tires generates exponentially as you go faster just as breaking distance does.

Best to play things safe...

 

[06Pete]

I think backing the loader up will put more weight on the trailer axles and less on the truck. I would go to a local quarry and see if they will let you play on the scales when they are not busy and find out where to put it so the trailer is carrying 34000 on the axles and the truck carrys the rest.

 

[Birken Vogt]

The way I see it, it's transferring more of the weight to the truck the way you have it now. If you move it back, it would just make the trailer haul more of the weight which of course makes each tire carry more weight.

The equalizer on the axles should be making each tire carry the same amount either way you do it if I'm thinking right.

I agree with this assessment although it does not seem to be the majority opinion right now.

I guess you have to axle it on a scale if you really want to know.

 

[wmshooke]

Had a smaller trailer that started blowing front axle tires after about 6 years of work with occasional overloading. Turned out the front springs had sagged letting the tire rub the underside of the deck when fully loaded. I would have thought axle stops would keep the tires from ever rubbing the deck, but the blocks were about an inch too short (even with factory original size tires).
Replaced the springs and now have much more clearance when loaded.

 

[shopguy]

I f you back it up to the ramps not only do I hope you have GOOD trailer tires but brakes as well because the ones on the empty truck wont have much traction ,be safe.