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Repairing creeping Bobcat
- Thread starter willie59
- Start date
willie59
Administrator
Common adjustment problem on Bobcats, easy to fix. For this, you would adjust the flat linkage bars that go from the drive lever control rods at the front and connect to the pintle levers on pumps. The drive levers typically go foward until they hit the cutouts in the front plate behind your legs. If the right seems to go farther forward, I'm guessing you need to make your left drive linkage bar shorter.
With engine off, raise the cab. You'll see those two linkage bars in the center of the machine. About the midpoint of the bars, the two piece bars are connected with 3/8" bolts in slotted holes. Facing from the front of machine, the left drive bar would be the one on your right. Take a Sharpie, and put a mark on the forward portion of that bar about an 1/8" from where it joins the rear section of bar. Slightly loosen connection bolts, wiggle the bar connection while lightly pulling back on left drive lever until the rear section of bar meets the mark that you made on front bar, lock bolts down. Make sure you have the linkage bar straight and not a dog leg angle at the connection. You simply adjust the bars until the machine tracks straight when you have drive levers thrown all the way forward. If it still travels faster in rev than fwd, and you want the fwd speed, shorten both bars (left and right) until you achieve this.
willie59
Administrator
Well, time to post an update to the creeping Bobcat thread. We have an S185 that we purchased new, has right around 1000 hours on it now. The spools and centering bars have already been replaced twice by dealer during warranty service. Now, it's creeping again, more wear on spools and centering bars. Dag nabit! This is about annoying! Damn Chinese steel! I called my Bobcat dealer and talked to the Service manager. Told Issac what was happening and asked if there was anything we could do to fix this annoying problem. He said "yeah, I'll put together a parts list for ya and fix you up". Our machine has the two piece steel pintle arms, but I suspect if you have the aluminum pintle arms that have these worn spools and bars, these parts may work on them as well.
Safety Warning: Never perform these repairs unless machine is raised of the ground and resting on sufficient stands/blocks with all wheels off ground and free to turn.
While waiting on my go-fer to go get parts, proceeded with removing components. Now this S185, unlike the 753 at beginning of this thread, has a hydraulic driven fan. These components make it really difficult to reach in work on the drive centering plate components, removing the spools would be difficult. So, instead of repairing centering spools with pintle arms attached to drive motors, I opted to remove pintle arms.
Cage the centering spring as shown in post #1 of this thread, remove centering spring/bolt, and remove the centering plate. You now have access to the pintle arms.
Remove the nut that attaches links from drive levers to pintle arm, you have to hold the bolt head from underneath or bolt will turn on this model. Then remove the two 3/8" bolts that attach the pintle arm to the drive pump lever.
Now you simply lift the pintle arm off of the pump shaft lever. Yeah, there's those junk worn centering spools.
Flip the pintle arm over and clamp centering spools in a vise, remove the retainer bolts and remove spools from arm.
Your going to have some wear on the centering bars as well, remove the bolts that mount them and turn them around 180 degrees and you'll have a new surface to work with.
Ok, here are the goodies. Stud mounted cam follower bearings, 4 flanged nuts, 4 thick shim washers, and 8 thin shim washers.
Here's your parts list from Bobcat and todays parts prices per each:
(4) #6673789 cam follower bearing $29.14
(8) #25E17 thin shim washers .98
(4) #6557831 thick shim washer .78 (less than thin washers?)
(4) #98D6 flanged 3/8-24 nut 1.38
Or use a Timken CRSB-14 cam follower bearing from a bearing supplier, appx 17.00 each
Safety Warning: Never perform these repairs unless machine is raised of the ground and resting on sufficient stands/blocks with all wheels off ground and free to turn.
While waiting on my go-fer to go get parts, proceeded with removing components. Now this S185, unlike the 753 at beginning of this thread, has a hydraulic driven fan. These components make it really difficult to reach in work on the drive centering plate components, removing the spools would be difficult. So, instead of repairing centering spools with pintle arms attached to drive motors, I opted to remove pintle arms.
Cage the centering spring as shown in post #1 of this thread, remove centering spring/bolt, and remove the centering plate. You now have access to the pintle arms.
Remove the nut that attaches links from drive levers to pintle arm, you have to hold the bolt head from underneath or bolt will turn on this model. Then remove the two 3/8" bolts that attach the pintle arm to the drive pump lever.
Now you simply lift the pintle arm off of the pump shaft lever. Yeah, there's those junk worn centering spools.
Flip the pintle arm over and clamp centering spools in a vise, remove the retainer bolts and remove spools from arm.
Your going to have some wear on the centering bars as well, remove the bolts that mount them and turn them around 180 degrees and you'll have a new surface to work with.
Ok, here are the goodies. Stud mounted cam follower bearings, 4 flanged nuts, 4 thick shim washers, and 8 thin shim washers.
Here's your parts list from Bobcat and todays parts prices per each:
(4) #6673789 cam follower bearing $29.14
(8) #25E17 thin shim washers .98
(4) #6557831 thick shim washer .78 (less than thin washers?)
(4) #98D6 flanged 3/8-24 nut 1.38
Or use a Timken CRSB-14 cam follower bearing from a bearing supplier, appx 17.00 each
willie59
Administrator
Here's the assembly process. Place one thin shim washer and one thick shim washer on each cam follower studs. This makes them the approximate same height as the old spools.
Mount the cam bearings to the pintle arms with new flanged nuts.
Install the reversed centering bars using one thin shim washer between centering bar and centering plate. For the centering bar that has two round bolt holes, lock that one down tight. On the opposite end with slotted holes, push centering bar away from opposite bar and lightly tighten bolts, they will be adjusted later.
Now re-install the pintle arms on the pump levers, lightly tighten the two bolts that fasten the pintle arms to the pump lever. Fit the drive lever link bars to the pintle arms, make sure the pintle arms are parallel when locking down nut on drive lever link bolts. If you have pintle arms forward or rearward and lock down nut on link bolts, the torsion bushings in pintle arms won't be set properly. Go back to post #4 of this thread for drive neutral adjusting procedure.
Got everything back together, cam rollers contact centering bars perfect. You can see two of the cam rollers in left side of pic. Don't think I'm going to have a problem with this for a while. Sweet!
Mount the cam bearings to the pintle arms with new flanged nuts.
Install the reversed centering bars using one thin shim washer between centering bar and centering plate. For the centering bar that has two round bolt holes, lock that one down tight. On the opposite end with slotted holes, push centering bar away from opposite bar and lightly tighten bolts, they will be adjusted later.
Now re-install the pintle arms on the pump levers, lightly tighten the two bolts that fasten the pintle arms to the pump lever. Fit the drive lever link bars to the pintle arms, make sure the pintle arms are parallel when locking down nut on drive lever link bolts. If you have pintle arms forward or rearward and lock down nut on link bolts, the torsion bushings in pintle arms won't be set properly. Go back to post #4 of this thread for drive neutral adjusting procedure.
Got everything back together, cam rollers contact centering bars perfect. You can see two of the cam rollers in left side of pic. Don't think I'm going to have a problem with this for a while. Sweet!
willie59
Administrator
Time for an update to this thread. One common problem with Bobcat drive pumps is leaking seals on the pump control shafts. It's an easy fix, doesn't require drive pump removal or major disassembly. If you happen to be in there doing repairs to the pintle arms or drive centering and you see leakage of the pump shaft seals, you should consider replacing the seals while you have things apart. This one is on a T200 track machine.
Once you have the drive centering plate and pintle arm removed, simply remove the 4 bolts that mount the centering plate guide bracket.
Remove the guide bracket, you'll then be looking at the seal plate.
Lift the seal plate off of the pump.
There's the lip seal you need to replace.
There's also a ring seal that seals the shaft seal plate and pump housing. Some models use an o-ring seal, others use a square cut lathe ring seal, you're Bobcat dealer may ask which one your machine uses, so you might want to get a peek and see which one you have before you order/pickup your parts.
One thing to keep in mind, there's going to be some oil leaking out when you remove the seal plate. On this one I wasn't terribly concerned because it has already made an oily mess in the area. But for one that's just seeping oil, and you don't want to make a big mess, keep the hose from your suck bucket evacuating the oil from the area while you have the plate off and are replacing the seal in the seal plate.
Also, be sure and polish the pump control shaft with fine emory cloth to remove rust or roughness of shaft before re-installing the seal plate. Use your suck bucket to remove the rusty oil caused by cleaning the shaft.
Once you have the drive centering plate and pintle arm removed, simply remove the 4 bolts that mount the centering plate guide bracket.
Remove the guide bracket, you'll then be looking at the seal plate.
Lift the seal plate off of the pump.
There's the lip seal you need to replace.
There's also a ring seal that seals the shaft seal plate and pump housing. Some models use an o-ring seal, others use a square cut lathe ring seal, you're Bobcat dealer may ask which one your machine uses, so you might want to get a peek and see which one you have before you order/pickup your parts.
One thing to keep in mind, there's going to be some oil leaking out when you remove the seal plate. On this one I wasn't terribly concerned because it has already made an oily mess in the area. But for one that's just seeping oil, and you don't want to make a big mess, keep the hose from your suck bucket evacuating the oil from the area while you have the plate off and are replacing the seal in the seal plate.
Also, be sure and polish the pump control shaft with fine emory cloth to remove rust or roughness of shaft before re-installing the seal plate. Use your suck bucket to remove the rusty oil caused by cleaning the shaft.
LWG
Well-Known Member
Very clever use of zip ties. I will file that idea away for use whenever I disassemble components with springs in tight spots.
Sam_French
Member
Thank you for posting Atco. If you were to put all this information in a book. Put me down for a couple of copies.
Have a nice day.
Sam
Have a nice day.
Sam
willie59
Administrator
LoL...me thinks I'm already in the process of putting together the book here Sam. :tong
wildernesss1958
New Member
Would that be the same on my T190 2003 bobcat
wildernesss1958
New Member
would that be the same on my T190 2003 as it is here for the creeping bobcat?
wildernesss1958
New Member
would this be the same for my 2003 T190 as you descriibed here?
willie59
Administrator
Welcome to the forum wildernesss1958.
Yes, the things on this thread are common Bobcat skid items, T190 should pretty much be the same thing.
Yes, the things on this thread are common Bobcat skid items, T190 should pretty much be the same thing.
Many thanks, ATCO....My 773G never sat or steered so nice, before I followed your steps. I found the left pintle arm was loose, and
tightened it, adjusted per your post, and she's smooth as silk! Love the zip tie trick, also. I now know what I'm feeling when things
don't act right. Mike
tightened it, adjusted per your post, and she's smooth as silk! Love the zip tie trick, also. I now know what I'm feeling when things
don't act right. Mike
willie59
Administrator
Welcome to the forum real550A. :usa
Good to hear this info was of help to you, that's the reason I posted it. You can bet Bobcat makes some good money on these simple repairs, and they're not really all that hard to do if you can stand working on top of one of those uncomfortable little critters.
Good to hear this info was of help to you, that's the reason I posted it. You can bet Bobcat makes some good money on these simple repairs, and they're not really all that hard to do if you can stand working on top of one of those uncomfortable little critters.
Memphisdoug
Member
Bobcat 873 Steering Problem
I have a Bobcat 873 with a problem with the steering control arms. The left hand arm causes the left wheels to move forward and back as soon as it is moved from the neutral position. The right hand arm has a lot more travel that is required both forward and back before the right wheels will move. It makes it somewhat hard to make left hand turns while moving because the right had wheels won't go as fast as the left. From reading the above posts, I am guessing that I may have a loose clamping bolt or worn pintle arm. I don't have any creep yet. My serial number is 514115288 if that is any help in determining the type of linkage I have. Any hints on how I should proceed with a repair? Thanks in advance for any help.
I have a Bobcat 873 with a problem with the steering control arms. The left hand arm causes the left wheels to move forward and back as soon as it is moved from the neutral position. The right hand arm has a lot more travel that is required both forward and back before the right wheels will move. It makes it somewhat hard to make left hand turns while moving because the right had wheels won't go as fast as the left. From reading the above posts, I am guessing that I may have a loose clamping bolt or worn pintle arm. I don't have any creep yet. My serial number is 514115288 if that is any help in determining the type of linkage I have. Any hints on how I should proceed with a repair? Thanks in advance for any help.
willie59
Administrator
Welcome to the forum Memphisdoug. :usa
Whether you have the aluminum or steel pintle arms, if the clamp bolt comes loose that attaches them to the pump control shaft you're going to have some form of fwd/rev creep on the drive, it will be hard to control the machine as you can't get it to settle into neutral.
If you have no creep, but have a very sloppy drive lever, you could have a bad bushing in the end of the traverse control rod that the drive lever attaches to, or you could have a bad torsion bushing on the control link that goes from traverse control rod to pintle arm. You need to raise your cab and see if you can determine what is causing the slack in the drive lever.
Whether you have the aluminum or steel pintle arms, if the clamp bolt comes loose that attaches them to the pump control shaft you're going to have some form of fwd/rev creep on the drive, it will be hard to control the machine as you can't get it to settle into neutral.
If you have no creep, but have a very sloppy drive lever, you could have a bad bushing in the end of the traverse control rod that the drive lever attaches to, or you could have a bad torsion bushing on the control link that goes from traverse control rod to pintle arm. You need to raise your cab and see if you can determine what is causing the slack in the drive lever.
Memphisdoug
Member
That's where I'm confused. I tilted the cab up and took off the right hand access plate on the side of the machine. As soon as I move the right hand drive lever forward or back I see the centering plate move. It's not like I have to move the lever a bunch before the centering plate moves. So - it seems like the lever is moving the control valve without problem. Is it possible to have something wrong with the valve that would cause my problem. Perhaps I need to take a closeer look at the whole linkage thing too. It looks like some tight quarters to work in there!
willie59
Administrator
I think it's time to remove the centering plate and get a better look at pintle arm components.
Coastal
Senior Member
Holy crap this is awesome....I've been fighting with this thing creeping for a while, i found the aluminum arm was loose, now i tightened it and the left track wants to go backwards. So the last 3 hours have been trying to adjust this thing. Now I know how!
Thank you!
:notworthy:notworthy:notworthy:notworthy
Thank you!
:notworthy:notworthy:notworthy:notworthy