Its that time of year. Lets discuss ether.

[Hobbytime]

ether works great for mounting tires..again not an approved method , but when out in the woods and not left with much choice , it will get the tires sealed back on the rim, just stand back and out of the way incase it blows the bead off the rim...

 

[fast_st]

You guys talking about ether washing down the cylinder walls? how much are you using? I've got a deere that'll start without it but I'm leery of long cranking times tearing up the starter. Near 0F, a one second shot into the outer air cleaner will have the engine running in four seconds of cranking, I'll usually crank for 3 and then give it a whiff, then 4-5 more and it'll start up as gentle as pie. No banging knocking or rattling. It runs out of that 1 second of ether after five seconds of running but by then its already fired up on all six. It just complains for another ten seconds. Without the gas its a minute or two of cranking with some partial starting before it'll hold on its own, then another 10-20 seconds of smoking like crazy before it smooths out.

 

[Jonas302]

You guys talking about ether washing down the cylinder walls? how much are you using? I've got a deere that'll start without it but I'm leery of long cranking times tearing up the starter. Near 0F, a one second shot into the outer air cleaner will have the engine running in four seconds of cranking, I'll usually crank for 3 and then give it a whiff, then 4-5 more and it'll start up as gentle as pie. No banging knocking or rattling. It runs out of that 1 second of ether after five seconds of running but by then its already fired up on all six. It just complains for another ten seconds. Without the gas its a minute or two of cranking with some partial starting before it'll hold on its own, then another 10-20 seconds of smoking like crazy before it smooths out.

Agreed if you can get enough ether in there to wash down the cyl walls get between the rings and remove all the oil trapped in there it is defiantly going to cause engine damage its going to take more than a couple cans for that to happen (;

When using common sense the ether to fuel rate is so ridiculously small it isn't going to wash down the cylinder or destroy the pistons

Had a truck today that didnt get plugged in long enough about three hours on the cord around 0f colder last night and the 2 new 4d batterys in there couldn't get her rolling and it wasnt going to do any good to try for more and a second Ran the queen bee with extension pipe elbowed up at the oil pan (keeps the fire danger down and puts the heat right where you need it) That cummins was smelling a hit either the next time i hit the key and fired right up throttle wide open until it was running backed down to 1500 until it wanted to stay running smooth at idle
No knocked no excitement at all just standard operating procedure around here Let it warm up for an hour or so and ready to get to work while I can get on to other things like getting the 950 running and laying under another truck burning off the ice thats blocking the slack adjusters from releasing the front brake

 

[RZucker]

Pretty much this^^^. Ether in moderation is sometimes a necessary evil in cold weather. Unfortunately some people think it's a cure all. It's not. More than once I've seen guys try to prime an engine with the stuff, had a customer ruin 2 injectors and a priming pump on a C-15 cat trying to start it. Why? It had lost one of the ECM feeds and wouldn't fire the injectors but they kept trying till they broke the tips off.

 

[DIYDAVE]

Last week I needed to move some snow around with the grader. Plugged in the block heater and returned to start it when I discovered the block was still cold. After 12 years the 2000W block heater had failed. Not wanting to put the ether to it right away, (tempertures was right around zero F), I went into town to buy a new heater and ran into a old farmer friend. He said that he had used WB-40 on his JD machines instead of ether. His thinking was it supplied some lubrication. I ended up using ether as I was not in the mood to to clamp off cold hoses for the replacement and I was concerned about WD-40 messing up my paper air filters.
Any thoughts on using WD-40 instead of ether?

Try this , instead: Take out the paper element, and insert a bernzomatic or similar propane torch, with the gas on, but not lit. Put throttle all the way up Give it a few seconds, and start cranking. Most of the time they fire right up. Remember that almost all aerosol oil products use butane as the propellant, and propane and butane are both simple fuels...

 

[Ronsii]

^^ The propane torch trick works great for motorcycles too. it's a lot easier than getting them flooded with fuel when they been sitting a while.

 

[bushcat]

Some machines that are located in extreme cold conditions have a zero start system installed that when activated shoots a measured amount of ether directly into the intake to aid in starting

 

[Brodiesel]

I like the propane torch method, Im going to try that.

In my relatively limited experience it seems either is especially bad for IDI diesels. In an IDI, combustion happens inside a pre-combustion chamber so when you shoot ether in there, a very violent blast is coming out of the chamber through a small port and BAM- right onto the piston, I have seen this leave deep gouges into the piston crown.

 

[fast_st]

What if you had the propane torch and had it lit? wouldn't that be similar to an intake air heater or that zany configuration in some Perkins engines.

 

[Welder Dave]

Perkins thermo-start burns diesel in the intake and works really well. For really cold weather like -30 and below some Perkins will use an optional ether injection system.

 

[RZucker]

Anybody remember the old Cummins "build a fire in the intake manifold" system? Glow plug and hand pump, worked well if you knew how to use it.

 

[ol' Grump]

Last year some dimwit tried to start a 416 Cat backhoe with the ether injection switch, putting ether in the engine w/o cranking it at the same time. Result? Cracked head and I believe one bent rod. I'll occasionally use a little goose juice on my own equipment in cold weather, but I'm cranking the engine at the same time I aim the can at the intake.

 

[check]

Often the air cleaner is not accessible to the operator station. In those cases I use a small shot of ether on the air cleaner and run to the operator station. Since I don't use much ether, I might have to run 2 or 3 times.
In many cases, as I'm half deaf to begin with, I can't hear the engine very well because of other engines running or in excavators it's far from the glassed in cab. So when I hear the engine start to rev, I back the rack off quickly which often results in shutting the engine down. No problem. I do it 2 or 3 times if necessary. Trying to use enough ether or rack to get it going the first time can be an easy way to ruin an engine.

 

[Birken Vogt]

I leave the rack full on until that sucker is running. First chance might be the only chance with bad batteries. Diesel fuel will not hurt it.

But ether might. I really do not like dousing an air filter with a long intake tract. It seems that sometimes you have to spray a lot of ether to get it to fire and once it does take off it draws the remaining ether from the air filter and sometimes it is more than you want.

But sometimes desperate times call for desperate means. I just don't want to be the one responsible for a customer engine just to save 20 minutes of work starting it some other way.

 

[Queenslander]

If it doesn't start with ether you can always resort to swearing at the #@&%ing thing.

 

[Mjrdude1]

Too much ether and boom, broken rings. $8000.00 later for an inframe overhaul and loss of the machine for a week. Ether is just too expensive.

 

[Mother Deuce]

I am in the gas/rag school of thought. I was taught that by a very senior hand quite sometime ago. Been doing it for years as needed. Rarely use ether, just hate that pounding.

 

[Grady]

Yair . . .

I have never had to contend with the cold some of the folks here speak of but I always felt the gasoline soaked rag in the inlet or around the pre cleaner was as effective as a spray can and (to me) the engines sounded happier without that ether rattle.

Cheers.

Agree. Always works for me. Don't need ether.

 

[56wrench]

do not ever use ether on a deutz air-cooled diesel. It will stretch the cyl barrel studs(which also hold the cyl heads on) and the cyl heads will leak compression, requiring top end repair. these engines require a heater element in the air hosing to warm the cylinders. Or use a herman-nelson to warm the whole engine

 

[td25c]

Perkins thermo-start burns diesel in the intake and works really well. For really cold weather like -30 and below some Perkins will use an optional ether injection system.

Have the same " Thermo - start " option on the Ford tractors . Hold the key switch in " heat start " position for about 30 seconds to warm it up . Basically turns the intake manifold in to a small fuel oil furnace . Pretty good setup , I like it !
https://www.tractorjoe.com/c5ne9a436a-heater-thermostart-intake-manifold-1

Detroit's & Allis Chalmers industrial engines also had a similar set up .