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Grading bucket

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
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49
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Rhode Island
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Master electrician
Hello everyone, this is my first post. I was searching the net for any info on building a grading bucket possibly tilting and came across this forum. I also have plans to make a 12 inch bucket for trenches. I started collecting materials. I figured I would use 3/8 plate and a plow cutting edge and maybe double plate or add 1/2 plate in curtain areas. I have a 2013 jcb 3cx extend a hoe with a wain Roy xls coulpler. So I have to integrate that mount into the design. I found a 4.5 inch pipe with a 1/4 inch wall thickness I'm hoping that will be strong enough. So I still have a few questions about the design, I would like to make a curve like a typical buckets design but don't think I'll be able to bend the plate. Is there a tip to bending 3/8 plate. I was also thinking about using a section of 12 pipe and cutting an area out to make the curve. I would like the bucket to be at least 48 inches wide, should it be less or more? I would greatly appreciate any input anyone would like to offer. Thank you
 

movindirt

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Sep 5, 2013
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under a shady tree
3/8ths inch steel should be plenty thick for the back, I think our Cat 303 buckets have maybe 3/16ths inch rolled for the back plate, the sides are also 3/16ths with a couple pieces of 3/8ths inch down the front edges for strength and wear. Also 4 pieces of 3/8ths inch bar 2" wide up and down on the back of the bucket for strength and wear. The ears for the pins are 1/2 inch plate. What size machine is this?
 

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
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Location
Rhode Island
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Master electrician
3/8ths inch steel should be plenty thick for the back, I think our Cat 303 buckets have maybe 3/16ths inch rolled for the back plate, the sides are also 3/16ths with a couple pieces of 3/8ths inch down the front edges for strength and wear. Also 4 pieces of 3/8ths inch bar 2" wide up and down on the back of the bucket for strength and wear. The ears for the pins are 1/2 inch plate. What size machine is this?

Thanks for the info. I was thinking 3/16s also I was thinking I could bend it easier and weld as I go but I went with the 3/8 because I didn't know if 3/16 was enough metal. The machine is a jcb 3cx
 

Delmer

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3/8" is overkill, but why not. Take the plate and a template of the curve you want to somebody with a brake and it will take 10 minutes to bend, that's 9 minutes explaining and setting up, and 30 seconds pressing it. I suppose a section of pipe would work for a grading bucket. I have a 42" ditching bucket that has way more capacity than a section of pipe would have. 48" should be fine for grading. Have you tried looking for a ditching bucket to adapt to fit? or are you looking for something else in the design?
 

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
Messages
49
Location
Rhode Island
Occupation
Master electrician
I was gonna add flat plat to the curve section of pipe so it would almost look factory. I also have to incorporate the wain Roy coupler into the design. I would love to add a tilt feature I'm just not sure about what cylinders to use. I have a remote circuit it's only plumbed to the top of the main boom so I would need to extend it. I don't even know how to control it. I have a foot pedal that works the extend hoe and another simple push bottom on the other floor side and bottoms on each joy stick. The machine also has a hammer circuit botton. All the similar buckets with tilt I found where 3k new.
 

Scrub Puller

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Gladstone Queensland Australia
Yair . . .

About "curving" plate.

As mentioned by Delmer Rather than rolling many curved sections are pressed in a series of passes on a break press.

The process can be calculated, that is to say so many sections so far apart by so many degrees or, the other extreme . . . "bump, bump, bump, bloody hell, too much turn it over and flatten it out a bit."

I prefer the middle ground with some basic calcs and a mark out.

To take this concept further out in the sticks it is possible to do exactly the same by marking out the plate and cutting a series of oxy or disk cuts at appropriate intervals leaving "tabs" every couple of feet to maintain alignment. The plate is usually welded to a push beam or whatever and decent handles tacked on for applying bending force . . . smaller sections can be held in a vice and bent with an adjustable wrench.

A lot of work, but properly rewelded and ground it will be indistinguishable from the real deal.

Cheers,
 

Delmer

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All the similar buckets with tilt I found where 3k new.

True enough, but if you want to make your own tilt, you're still better off starting with a ditching bucket IMHO. Building buckets is "grunt work", I don't think I paid $250 for mine and I know I couldn't get it done for that. As for the tilt feature, copy, copy, copy.
 

movindirt

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Might want to look around for a few months unless its a huge hurry, never know what deals you might find. I found a used Helac 180* rotator for my 3 ton mini that pins right on for $1,400, its got a hydraulic q/c built in on it too. Having the ability to pivot the bucket 90* to the stick is awesome. Most tilts with cylinders only have 45* or less of travel either side. As for a bucket, I got a 48" bucket off a backhoe for a couple hundred bucks, changed the ears and was good to go.
 

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
Messages
49
Location
Rhode Island
Occupation
Master electrician
Yair . . .

About "curving" plate.

As mentioned by Delmer Rather than rolling many curved sections are pressed in a series of passes on a break press.

The process can be calculated, that is to say so many sections so far apart by so many degrees or, the other extreme . . . "bump, bump, bump, bloody hell, too much turn it over and flatten it out a bit."

I prefer the middle ground with some basic calcs and a mark out.

To take this concept further out in the sticks it is possible to do exactly the same by marking out the plate and cutting a series of oxy or disk cuts at appropriate intervals leaving "tabs" every couple of feet to maintain alignment. The plate is usually welded to a push beam or whatever and decent handles tacked on for applying bending force . . . smaller sections can be held in a vice and bent with an adjustable wrench.

A lot of work, but properly rewelded and ground it will be indistinguishable from the real deal.

Cheers,
I do have a 20 ton hand press but it's only 20 inches wide. I could do it as you suggest but would have to peace it together.
 

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
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Rhode Island
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Master electrician
I've been looking about a month I've found other buckets without tilt in the 700 range. I might just build a standard bucket then add tilt this winter. I have a ton of work around the yard and it would be nice to start before the heat gets here.
 

Tags

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Feb 19, 2012
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Connecticut
I've been looking about a month I've found other buckets without tilt in the 700 range. I might just build a standard bucket then add tilt this winter. I have a ton of work around the yard and it would be nice to start before the heat gets here.

In my opinion you would be better off buying a used grading bucket and then adapt the tilt feature to that. It will save you a ton of fabricating, welding, and most of all time. I see you're in RI, head over to Jobsite Equipment and have a look around, I'm pretty sure they have a bunch of used and new buckets sitting there. You could also do an attachment search on Machinery Trader, just search "wain roy" or "grading bucket" tons of buckets will come up.
 

Steve328

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image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpgI started building the bucket. I already bought the 3/8 plate and I need it yesterday so I'll just build it and the left over metal I can make the 12 inch bucket.
 

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
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Rhode Island
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Master electrician
Can anyone help out with info about what type of cylinder would work best with a 48 inch bucket pictured above. I've read in other post about a 1 1/2 bore but that was with a mini excavator not a backhoe. and how is the length measured. Fully compressed or extended. Thank you
 

Delmer

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The bore is related to the distance from the pivot, 1 1/2 would be fine at 10-20" from the pivot, I'd guess. The length is usually the stroke of the cylinder, Pin to pin or center to center max and min are the other measurements. Overall length also if it's tight at the ends...
 

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
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Master electrician
Thank delmer. Hydraulics are new to me. I think I'm gonna go with a 1 1/2 bore and a 6 inch stroke. Then tilt the bucket fully one direction and extend the cylinder completely and weld in place.
 

Steve328

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image.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpgimage.jpgSo I started welding some parts together. I haven't been devoting much time to it seeing I'm waiting on a cylinder and pin but here's some progress
 

Steve328

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May 24, 2016
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Rhode Island
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Master electrician
So I've been working on the tilt setup for the bucket. After ordering three cylinders I got the right one 3 inch bore 1.75 rod. The 1 1/2 bore was way to small and the 4 inch bore was way to big. After reading another post about a Deere 310 aux circuit being one way for the hammer circuit I think mine might be the same. Is there anyway I can tell if I have flow both ways. Would both lines go to a block with solenoids vs a return to the tank. Another question can I use my front aux circuit to control the tilt or thumb I don't mind turning around to reach the stick. Thank you for any help
 

Tarhe Driver

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Leading Edge Attachments, Inc. formerly carried a 2-Way Bucket. The patent is held by a childhood friend of mine, but it is not now in production. The following describes it pretty well. Since you'd not be building it for sale, there probably wouldn't be any restrictions on anyone's building one.

Allows the operator to have a shovel style bucket and a trenching style bucket at the same time. The internal swinging plate has welded stops that allow the plate to swing back and forth and hold the material on which ever side the operator chooses to use. When the trenching side is used, the baffle swings toward the rear and the stops hold the baffle plate to hold the material. When the shovel side is used, the baffle plate swings toward the front and the stops hold the material in that position. The capacities of either side are approximately the same. The uses for this combination trenching and shovel bucket are endless. Operators have claimed that they gain more than 50% increase in productivity with the use of this bucket.

The following lists some of this bucket's advantages:

Universal Advantages

Matches or outperforms conventional buckets in traditional hoe-to-hoe or shovel-to-shovel assignments.

Reduces crew time in almost every two-way scenario.

Reduces crew exposure in almost every two-way scenario.

Cost (time) saving potential in every working environment.

Constructed of abrasion-resistant steel.

Bedding Materials Installation

Excavates spoil and lays bedding material in a single pass.

Minimizes or eliminates trench-wall weeping.

Minimizes or eliminates cave-ins.

Minimizes or eliminates contamination of bedding materials by trench-wall encroachment.

Minimizes or eliminates bedding materials waste

Minimizes or eliminates requirement for second machines (wet conditions, etc.)

Dump Truck Unloading (shovel position)

Minimizes or eliminates dump-body latch damage.

Minimizes or eliminates dump truck down time from body damage.

Minimizes or eliminates the need to safety chain tailgates.

Increases dump truck effectiveness by unloading a significantly greater amount of the dump-truck load.

Trench (Shield) Box Placement and Removal

Reduces or eliminates need for slings & chains

Reduces or eliminates undue force on box during installation

Reduces or eliminates undue force on box during extraction

Reduces or eliminates machine relocation

Doubles lifting opportunities

Mass Excavation/Rubble Loading

From a single machine position, capture and load from both sides of the pile

Reduces and usually eliminates pile chasing

Reduces and usually eliminates requirement for a second machine

Precision Digging

Digs all corners square.

Reduces or eliminates over-excavation.

Digs to dimensions, not beyond.

Greatly reduces the need for backfill or flowable fill.

Irregular spoil often removed within the desired excavation.

Reduces or eliminates machine relocations.

Digs closer around utilities, reducing or eliminating the need for hand shoveling and premature backfill.

Using shovel action, excavates closely beside existing pipes with little threat of rupture or need for hand shoveling.

When the desired excavation is within reach of one machine location, can dig all corners from one location.

Bucket Reconfiguration/Reversing

(Shovel to Hoe -- Hoe to Shovel)

Conventional bucket -- 5 to 90 minutes lost

Unrecoverable loss of machine time

Unrecoverable loss of crew time

Mechanic often required

2-Way Excavator Bucket

Merely work in the opposite direction –It’s as easy as having the thought and just as fast!!

No machine time loss

No crew time loss

Mechanic not required
 
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