Gooseneck to Haul JD 550

[redneckracin]

Gents,

I have been browsing the classifieds for quite awhile now and an interesting trailer came up for sale but I'm not sure what I think about it. I have a shared JD 550 dozer with my FIL and I would like to be able to move it. It is likely cheaper to have it moved by someone else, but I like to be able to move my stuff when I want to. Anyways, I found an older trailer circa 1976 for sale on a classifieds site and I was hoping to see if it was crazy to haul the dozer on it.

Here is the text from the sale ad: "For sale is a good solid 18,000 lb goose neck deck over dump trailer. Light weight is 4,560 lbs. LOTS of new parts including all spring hangers, equalizer bars, LED lights and adjustable hitch. Tires size is 12 x 16.5 with good tread."

I called and talked to the gentleman and it appears that its a 20k trailer and not 18k. From JD specs, the 550 goes around 16,000 plus I have a winch. What concerns me are the axles and tires. I think the heaviest 16.5" tire is rated for 4klbs. That doesn't seem like enough tire to handle the weights that I am thinking of. Any thoughts?


I do have my class a cdl.

 

[old-iron-habit]

So with winch you have a payload of over 17,000 lbs on a 18,000 lb gooseneck. Two axles with single tires. 8,000 lb axles with 2,000 on the neck? I'm trying to figure out how they got a 18,000 lb rating. What are you pulling it with? Probably doesn't matter as I'm quite certain the neck is not rated for the 3,500 or so lbs needed if you are balanced perfect. Not sure where the 550 weight comes from. If specs were used for weight estimate that could be dry weight and you actually weight more. My JD 455D weighed in on the scale every time at 17,400 with winch and fluids. I say you do need more trailer. Yes, to answer your question, I would say its crazy.

That square tailed trailer would also be a bugger to load that 550 on. Ramps long enough to work and carry the 550 would bust your back.

 

[redneckracin]

Correct. Supposedly the trailer is rated for 20k not 18k. I am waiting on pictures currently but I'm not quite sure how they got the rating. I'm pulling it with my international 4700 (dt530E MD3060), the truck is more than capable. I thought most GN trailers were supposed to have around 25% of the load on the neck anyways? 20k X .25=5k right? The 550 weight comes from here : https://www.deere.com/en_US/products/non_current/crawler_dozers/crawler_dozers.page? It seems to be pretty accurate even for your machine. I'm not 100% sure how much the winch weighs but I figured a 1klbs was reasonable.

 

[CM1995]

I would pass, that's not enough tires to carry the weight. Look for a dual tired, dual axle deck over pintle.

 

[redneckracin]

That's what I was thinking but in a GN, I don't have a heavy enough setup on the back of the truck for a pintle yet.

 

[lantraxco]

Most trailers are rated at GVWR, which means your 20K has to include the empty trailer weight, so payload is only about 15K. Can you haul the 550? Sure. Should you? Probably not and it won't be legal. YMMV

 

[fast_st]

I updated my trailer with 17.5 tires, 6k load per tire. 1k for a set with wheels. trailer super singles really

 

[redneckracin]

that's the next idea that popped into my head, swap the hubs or find wheels to fit and get better tires. I don;t know what the axles are rated for yet, I wanted to see a tag on them or something.

 

[fast_st]

Well, on mine, the HD wheels have the 8 on 6.5 so they fit right on my existing hubs. What I ordered looked like
www.ebay.com/itm//321994150256

swapped right on without a fuss, 16 ply, there is also 18 ply but the weight rating is the same.

 

[redneckracin]

Well, on mine, the HD wheels have the 8 on 6.5 so they fit right on my existing hubs. What I ordered looked like
www.ebay.com/itm//321994150256

swapped right on without a fuss, 16 ply, there is also 18 ply but the weight rating is the same.

What size axles did you put those tires on? That's a really good idea though. I'm still waiting on additional pics from the seller.

 

[fast_st]

I put them on 8k axles before upgrading to 12k

 

[redneckracin]

did you have any issues with the 8k axles after the tire upgrade? I guess I am asking what did you load them up to? I thought 17.5" tires were hard to come by in local tire shops?

 

[fast_st]

Well, maybe I'm lucky, I keep a spare but Nope, 17.5 has been around a long time, had a '63 with 17.5's on it. Its a truck tire shop thing though. I had the 8k's overloaded a bit but no ill effects. Its a single tire wide frame trailer so it seemed a good option to upgrade, stay with the super singles and keep everything in place. The non-dually wheel keeps the tire centered on the bearings. The only issue might be with that heavy of a tire, you can't eyeball the tire pressure too well.

 

[redneckracin]

Sounds good. I'm going to wait and see what the axles are spec'd at and do some pondering from there.

 

[Mark13]

That trailer will suck to put a dozer on. The ramps you would need would be 8ft long I bet and weigh more then you'd want to try lifting. Also the break over angle when you get to the deck from the ramps will likely be quite the ride, especially coming off the trailer and down the ramps.

I'd go find a 20+5 or 25+5 tandem dual gooseneck with 12k axles and preferably electric over hydraulic disc brakes. It won't care about the dozer, especially if you're slightly off on your weights and don't get it balanced right or the dozer ends up being 18k+. Pulling it with your 4700 won't be an issue and you won't be running the trailer right at max capacity or slightly over 100% of the time.

 

[redneckracin]

you are probably right mark. The upside to that trailer was the dump bed, I figured I could tilt it a bit to get the machine on, the price was right too. I have been looking for exactly what you described but alot of the trailers with the 12k axles don't rate the trailer any higher for weight. I missed the opportunity for a 30k GN with 15k axles for under 5k here a couple months ago, Ive been kicking myself for that one.

 

[RTSmith]

The reason the 12K axle trailers don't add weight is money. Any trailer that is 26,001 and up GVWR when sold new, has a 12% FET tax added to it. So it is common for a farmer or smaller contractor to want the heavier axles and springs, so he asks the manufacturer to rate it at 25,999 or so.

 

[Steve Frazier]

I just bought a 25K gooseneck that was originally equipped with dual 16" wheels. I substituted the 17.5 single on it at the factory, less weight, less drag and less cost overall. It's simply a bolt on swap, no mods required. In your case you'll double the capacity per tire, if the axles are rated for the load you're golden.

 

[fast_st]

I missed the question on what I'd loaded the 8k axles up to, well there was one load of logs that was north of 20k still plenty of spring left, the trailer mfg uses one I beam for all their trailers so 6 ton to 15 ton all use the same frame, easier maybe. Truck could tell it was heavy but the trailer never complained. Looking at hub and bearing sizes, trailer axles are nicely overbuilt. Have I had trailers that felt bad, yes, uhaul car trailer to move a 'Ford' well it was a ford backhoe, yeah, horrible feeling all the way, smushed it pretty good. This felt just dandy.

 

[old-iron-habit]

Nice thing about the 8,000 lb axles are the bigger brakes also.