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D20S Will not crank

Discussion in 'Other Earthmoving Equipment' started by rslawson, Dec 1, 2016.

  1. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    I just repaired hydraulic leak on D20S. I had it running yesterday. After repairing the leak I tried to start it and I can only get it to click one time. Both red lights come on when I turn the key to acc prior to cranking. I have tried everything. The batteries are brand new. Any help would be nice. I was wondering how to test starter/starter solenoid since it isn't trying to start at all.
     
  2. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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    Use a test lead with an alligator clip run to a multimeter in the cab. Then you can clip the wire to whatever terminal you want to check, go back to the seat, try to start it and see what the voltage is while it's supposed to be starting. Go through the battery terminals, big solenoid terminals, little solenoid terminal and you should see your problem.

    There's other ways some people use in person, but this is the safe way that I feel comfortable telling somebody online. It works, it's safe, and it doesn't take much time in the scheme of things.
     
  3. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    Delmer thanks for the relpy. I have an electrical background and I am mechanically inclined. I am not familiar with this type of equipment so I was wanting to see if I could use a "jumper" to engage the starter solenoid to make sure that is the culprit. I bought it over the summer however I found the leak coming from the bucket lever and I have not been able to run the machine because I did not want to operate it until I fixed the leak. I know you can bypass solenoids or jumper them on other vehicles to make sure the solenoid is the problem. Is there a relay or fuse I should check for also? Would the water in the fuel light have anything to do with my problem? Thanks again in advance.
     
  4. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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    Not being familiar with that type of equipment either, I don't know what you can jumper or not. I know I could figure it out with voltage readings of the different terminals and go from there. If you have more than one small wire going to the solenoid, then a manual is needed for me.

    From this site, I've heard of master relays on the positive battery cable on Japanese machines, that's something to keep in mind when you check the battery voltage while cranking, if the positive voltage seems to have a loose connection. I don't think the water in fuel light would have anything to do with it, but you could disconnect the wiring at the water separator, and drain it too of course.
     
  5. thepumpguysc

    thepumpguysc Senior Member

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    The "jumper" is exactly what Delmer was staying away from.. TOO MANY accidents from people NOT KNOWING what their doing..
    The safest way to do THAT, is to buy a $7.00 "remote starter button"..
    1 clip on the + side of the battery and the other clip to the small connection on the starter and STAND AWAY FROM THE MACHINE and push the button..
    The problem comes in when people leave the machine in gear and jump the starter..
    Your BY-PASSING ALL the safety mechanisms on the machine.. and the machine jumps forward and KILLS the person closest to it..
    OR actually starts and runs down the street, killing some poor sole..
     
  6. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    Thanks for that. I have taken the battery terminals off and cleaned them ( no corrosion), I took the lower panel on the left off the engine compartment. I turned the key with it in neutral and I can hear the starter clicking like it wants to start but that's all. One loud click. I can also see the spark from the plug so I know it's getting spark. I have a friend coming over to tap on the starter for me to see if that's the culprit. Thank you guys for all the tips. I have not attempted any jumpers.
     
  7. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    Pumpguysc.....If the starter is bad then the remote starter will let me know that meaning that it will not start correct? I had it running Monday evening. I changed the seal on the spool for the bucket lever and now it will not start. That's what has me so confused. I do not think I could have done anything while changing the seal out that could have caused this is there? I'm stuck scratching my head. I want to get it started to take it to my mechanic.
     
  8. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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    Only if the spool is stuck putting a load on the hydraulic pump, but the starter would still crank over a bit and stall, I'd think. Just make sure all the spools are centered.

    The test lead is nice because you can put it on the small solenoid terminal, try to start it and see that it has voltage when you turn the key. Then move it to the big solenoid terminal going to the starter, if that has voltage when the key is turned, then you whack the starter, and then take it apart if the whacking fails. What happens if the remote starter switch doesn't do anything? you're still not sure what's wrong.

    What plug is sparking?
     
  9. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    Delmer after reading your comment I realized you are correct no spark plug because of diesel motor. When I tried to start it makes one big click noise and then as I let the key go back I see an arc coming from under the seat towards the motor. I am going to take the floor pan off next so I can see exactly what is going on. I feel like a dork!!!! Hahaha.
     
  10. Wytruckwrench

    Wytruckwrench Well-Known Member

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    You shouldn't have any visible sparks. Sounds like a loose connection or a rubbed wire.
     
  11. thepumpguysc

    thepumpguysc Senior Member

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    Sparking ANYWHERE is no good. Fix that & your problems will probably go away..
     
  12. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    Yes I am going to look for the source of the spark this weekend. I put a 2Amp slow charger on the batteries last night and I am going to let it charge until I get off work today just to see if it is the batteries. The other charger I was using for the batteries was not working so the batteries may wind up being the culprit after all however it has shown me the spark issue so maybe it was meant to be.
     
  13. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    Ok I have found the arc. There are 3 large wires on the front of the solenoid. It looks like 2 are on solenoid and one is on the starter. There are 2 small wires that run from the front of the solenoid to another square unit beside the solenoid. One of the small wire terminals have broken off. It was just loose and when I attempted to start it the arc I would see is the terminal. Is there anyway I can run a wire from the battery to the starter to start the machine so I can raise the bucket to make the necessary repair. I have the wiring diagram however it is really hard to see. I have 24/25 volts coming off the batteries so I know batteries are good. I just need to get it started so I can make the repairs. Thanks.
     
  14. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    I need to bypass the safety and solenoid and jump the starter to repair it. As it sits I can not get to it to change it.
     
  15. Delmer

    Delmer Senior Member

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    See post #5 to start it safely. Or risk your neck with a screwdriver or jumper wire reaching into the starter.

    Sounds like job for a soldering iron and JBweld. Unless you can find the safety relay reasonably, use the numbers off the relay or whatever it is to search online for something with the same numbers and same terminals.
     
  16. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    I plan on soldering the broken piece. I am looking online now for the remote starter. Thanks for all the input.
     
  17. thepumpguysc

    thepumpguysc Senior Member

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    ANY parts store will have them.. Walmart, OR any tool truck..Snap-on, Mac, Matco.
    For GOD sakes, MAKE SURE the machine is in neutral w/ the brakes applied..
     
  18. rslawson

    rslawson Member

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    I will make sure it is in neutral. It is in my backyard at the bottom of my driveway. I found a push button and I have 10' leads on the push button. I will be careful. I have been doing nothing but reading on this all day and I really see no other way to repair it as the arms of the bucket are blocking access to the starter. I have a schematic from Komatsu now. The small wire that is under the terminal with the wire from the battery runs to the front(or cab area) of the starter and it goes under the top right terminal looking at it from inside the cab directly in front of the clutch spring. That screw terminal broke completely off. The terminal on the bottom left that has a small wire running to the small screw on the solenoid is where I am placing my push button wire. From what I have read and been told that will start it so I can load it to take it to the mechanic. I have tried to upload pictures with no luck. Thanks for your help and concerns. I am a fireman in Nashville so safety is always first and foremost.