3306 top end noise

[gwhammy]

This motor was in a big rock drill which wouldn't make it a equipment type motor.
We have them close together now, looks like the pumps will need to be changed and the intercooler done away with. The air filter bracket bolts to the top of the intake where the intercooler is.
Oil pan appears to be identical, harmonic balancer and pulleys are opposite.
I'm thinking we will strip any of the externals off and change if they are different.
Going to pull the pan and check bearings while it is out in the open. If they show any wear the bearing are getting changed. Should be able to look at the cam and bottom of the sleeves to look for any problems.
How does this motor time? That is the one thing we don't know yet.

I have a lot of confidence in the mechanic buddy working on it. I've seen him work on everything from lawnmowers to building four charger alcohol pulling tractors.

 

[kshansen]

How does this motor time? That is the one thing we don't know yet.

I have a lot of confidence in the mechanic buddy working on it. I've seen him work on everything from lawnmowers to building four charger alcohol pulling tractors.

Well to be safe before I try to comment on the timing, assume you are asking about fuel injection pump, I would need to know a S/N. Seams there are at least 10 different 973 prefixes and who know how many variations in each.

 

[gwhammy]

Yes injection pump timing. I've worked on cummins motors and they have timing pins to lock the cam and pump.
serial number of the machine or both of the motors? I've looked all over the one I just bought and don't see any id plates on it like on a cummins. Not real familiar with cat motors. I can get the one off the loader when I'm back around it this week and the other motor if you can tell me where to look.
I'm sure if I can come up with the info the guy working on them can do it.

 

[kshansen]

As for S/N see picture below. The red circle is where most of the tags are on the 3300 series Cats I have worked on. This would be looking at the left side of the block with flywheel end to the right in the picture. If you look close at the picture you can see the two rivets that would have held the tag on this block. If the tag is missing try cleaning off the area as
Cat usually stamped the numbers in there. Only problem might be if this block is not the original one for the application then all bets are off. But with the number we might be able to know what it was originaly used in to help some.

 

[gwhammy]

Thanks, I'll get them tomorrow if work allows.

 

[kshansen]

Maybe also some pictures of the original engine and the replacement engine would help.

 

[gwhammy]

Replacement engine didn't have a tag or stamping on the boss. You could tell where a tag had been riveted on.
The numbers and letters from top to bottom on the loader motor are
13213524
5c9442
ot4497
voo

I can get pictures tomorrow of both motors.

 

[Cmark]

That is actually 13Z13524.

 

[gwhammy]

Probably right I tend to scribble so bad I can't read some of the things I write.

 

[gwhammy]

Not positive but the replacement motor may have a shorter crank snout than the loader motor. That would be a problem. Put a big puller on one of the harmonic balancers and it didn't budge. Is there a secret or just a bigger puller?
Pulled the pan and the bearings look real good as does the bottom of the bore in the sleeves that we can see. Worst scenario is I have to fix my crank if it has problems or buy a crank kit. At least this is what I'm hoping.

 

[tctractors]

The front pulley has 4 threaded bolt holes in it , these are used to pull it off with a hydraulic cylinder and a hard bar bolted using all 4 of the holes, if you have put any strain against the Dampener it is possibly now just scrap? the flywheel and crank are marked with a chisel cut for correct indexing, it might be possible to pull the front pulley without the correct tooling using a hard bar 4 bolts and a spacer off the part undone front crank bolt, tighten it all up and give it a whack? tctractors

 

[DMiller]

We used a plate of 3/4" steel with a 1" fine thread nut welded to it over a drilled hole on all the tapered crank engines I have worked on. Get the pusher bolt wrench tight against the OE crank end bolt and rap on it with a 6-10 hammer. Have to disrupt the taper interference fit. The plate had alternate holes drilled for the old AC, Cummins, Cat and Detroit engines.

 

[gwhammy]

That's what a couple cat mechanics have told me also on the plate. This one is on the back burner as long as my 963 is running. My mechanic and I are real busy with dry weather.

 

[tctractors]

Some of these pulley's can be on very tight, I do have the correct tooling and often find 25 -30 ton force is needed to blow them free.
lets hope you have good luck tctractors

 

[kshansen]

I recall having to replace the front seal on a 980B loader in frame. What I remember doing was to find a disc of steel plate and drill holes to match up with the puller holes in the hub or pulley. I believe what I did was to thread the center bolt in so the head was a bit above that of the hub and then using 4 bolts of the right length install the new plate and tighten each bolt a little at a time till it popped free.

Hardened washers under the head of the four bolts with some anti-seeze would help reduce torque needed. Just be sure to not get any on the tapers when reinstalling, tapers should be clean and dry when assembled.

 

[DMiller]

Actually come loose easier that way than a hydraulic puller, or at least seems so. Have to remove less stuff!

 

[kshansen]

Actually come loose easier that way than a hydraulic puller, or at least seems so. Have to remove less stuff!

Main thing is to use a heavy enough steel plate and not use too long of bolts so they don't bottom out. And a little lube also helps.

Just looked up the recommended load on a 1/2 inch forged lifting eye to get an idea of the pulling power one could get. Chart says using a 5 to 1 safety factor a 1/2 eye is good for 2,200 pounds. So if push came to shove and you needed to go to the limit with four bolts you should be able to get a little over 20 tons before anything broke and if using grade 8 bolts probably a bit more.

 

[tctractors]

I have tackled the front pulley removal task on CAT engines at least 50 possibly 100's of times over the last 46 years (allow a min of 4 times a year? it's near 200) the small pulling threads in the pulley are not the place to put the screw load into, these bolts need to be in and level set with any screw effort only going against the loose crank nose bolt with the thick washer still towards the crank, this will save things flying about, it's common to find these small pulling threads stripped and very common on D342's and 353's.

 

[gwhammy]

Both out side by side, basically the same long block. Old motor gaulded a piston and started taking the wrist pin bushing out. Crank looks great, could have done an inframe on this motor. Glad we pulled it, a bolt behind the idler gear that drives the hydraulic pump had backed out and was rubbing hard on the back of the gear. This would have caused a bad problem down the road.