Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 16 to 30 of 30

Thread: Burning Your Waste Oil In Your Engine???

  1. #16
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    1,392
    I combined used oils in fuel systems on Cat dozers and scrapers, other machines too for several years in the eighties. It was an accepted practice then before emissions and the environment became such an issue. We filtered the oil carefully, also made sure that no one dumped cleaning solvent or coolant into the collection tank. Most of the engine manufacturers had specific standards for what percentage of used oil to fuel you could run. I would agree with some here that older machines up to about 1990 could run safely with used oil, after that, with the changes in fuel system technology, I don't believe I would try it.

    One project office manager that I worked with in Pennsylvania bought old home heating oil without my knowledge for use as fuel in our machines. He had done this on his previous project and saved a bundle on fuel costs. However, the high acid level of that fuel etched the injectors and the high pressure injector pump in a newer Cat 245 excavator and ended up costing us over 25000 bucks for new parts and labor. Thinking back, I believe it cost us an engine in a 777B haul truck too, which was not cheap to replace and there was a week or more down time on both machines to consider.

    I burned waste oil in a burner that heated our shop in Colorado. Believe we put about 50000 gallons through it in about two years. The heating element gave us constant trouble and the fuel filters were also in need of replacement nearly every week. The ash built up inside the heater tubes till they plugged up and when we used a shop vac to suck the ash out of those tubes, it blew right out of the vacuum all over the shop. It was an exceptionally fine powder, like talc. Had to dismantle the furnace and wash the tubes out after that fiasco. But that furnace kept the entire shop warm without the use of the infrared gas heaters located in rows on each side of the shop. I don't think you can use waste oil burners in Colorado anymore, not legally anyway.

    At the time (1992), Komatsu was injecting small amounts of engine oil into the intake manifold on WA600 loaders, of which I had two. This resulted in the plugging off of the air compressor discharge tube with a brownish coke like material. This happened to both machines at about the same time with maybe 3500 hours on each machine. After replacing the parts and realizing what caused the problem, we plugged off the line feeding the engine oil into the intake. Just an unintended consequence of what some engineer thought was a good idea.

    I do not know how Cat and others are burning used oil in their machines today other than the method does not use oil collected from several sources. The oil Cat uses is from the individual machines own engine, which as I recall, was Cat's recommendation years ago, which we ignored in our zeal to get rid of waste oil as cheaply as possible.

    Back then, we were under the hammer to be very careful about allowing waste oil off the projects, as the company had just gotten sucked into a federal cleanup at a used oil refinery in Salt Lake City, for which they were paying a large sum of money. As I recall, only one 4500 gallon load of company oil had been delivered to the refinery, but the company ended up being one of the top five firms cited and having to pay. We thought it was mostly the result of the outfit having deep pockets if you know what I mean.

    We didn't let any waste oil go off the job in Colorado, but in other places we did. In that time I sold waste oil for as much as 45 cents a gallon (in Maryland), and paid as much as 25 cents a gallon to have it removed in eastern Pennsylvania. I also started checking the places our waste oil went pretty closely as that was a time when some pretty serious problems were discovered with waste oil haulers and collection or refinery facilities. Indeed, there was a used oil barrel reconditioning facility in Grand Junction that was forced to close because of pollution problems. They'd been in business for decades and the ground the plant stood upon was heavily saturated with all kinds of bad stuff, and they were right on the edge of the Colorado River.

    There is a lot of soot and acid even in today's used motor oils. Take that into consideration if you decide to burn the oil in your engines. I don't know that it's worth the trouble really, the potential for expensive repairs and downtime are very real, plus the added expense of extra fuel filters or pre-filter fuel processing equipment. New oil isn't cheap either, which the engines that burn their own oil use in varying amounts. Next consider the effect the extra ash and soot have on catalytic converters and exhaust systems if waste oil is burned in systems with which equipped. User beware!

  2. #17
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    May 2008
    Location
    Cincinnati, OH
    Posts
    10
    BE CAREFUL. A good friend of mine has a duramax diesel and he changes his oil @ 50% life. He was running used oil and we had a full load of round bales on the gooseneck and the truck went into limp mode due to low rail pressure due to a dirty fuel filter. I went out and changed his filter and its was full of crap, the filter had only 200hrs. on it.

    Another thing the tier3 engines will not handle the crappy fuel any more. We had one run backwards in a linkbelt 330 with a 6hk1 isuzu. we found that the injector tip cracked and filled the cylinder with fuel. It had water in the fuel and the tip wouldn't pass the water drop. A tier3 injector tip has twice as many holes, but they are only half the size of a tier2

  3. #18
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    582
    I wouldnt w/these newer systems and tight clearances. Older diesels would burn about an ything

  4. #19
    Site Sponsor
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    72
    bstiles,

    The Duramax diesel in the Chevrolet/GMC pickups have a 4-micron filter. Your friend might want to change the filter again in the near future to prevent unplanned downtime. I've talked to several Duramax guys this winter, they are having the most trouble that I've heard of with fuel filter waxing in the cold weather. The new 2008 Duramax are a nightmare to change the fuel filter on I'm told. I thought the 2006 was bad enough. Once spring gets here a lot of the filter issues will fade away until next winter. Good luck! John
    Last edited by Johnsoils; 02-19-2009 at 12:57 AM. Reason: spelling and grammar
    "IF IT TURNS AND BURNS, IT NEEDS LUBRICATION"

    John Kahrs

    johnsoils.com

  5. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    In the Cut
    Posts
    148
    CAT's is called Oil Renewal System. (ORS) Only really seen it on 3500 engine's with EUI.

    A valve on the side Inject's a small amount of oil into the return side of the Fuel system and a Header tank up near the Master key (D11R) inject's fresh oil into the motor.

    Works well when it's not filling the crank case with fuel
    Last edited by Haul-Pak; 02-19-2009 at 01:36 AM.
    You only have 60 minutes to edit your post including Attachments! After that ... They Belong to HEF.

  6. #21
    Member datsunman's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Oronoco,MN
    Posts
    43

    Lightbulb Used oil does burn-I think the old gasogen system is key

    I read up about using wood to produce an 80 octain engine fuel for just about any engine and I wonder if the same system for vaporizing the wood could work to vaporize oils ? After all when you spill some used oil on any hot surface that makes the oil smolder well, it takes "instant flame" if a flame is passed through the rising smoke stream. So I believe any safe system that can heat the used oil up to a hot smoldering temp and then channels it directly to the combustion chamber along with a preheated air supply it should make a diesel run as well as a gas. I think of it as burning oil smoke not liquid oil so the waste particles may never enter the combustion chambers.

  7. #22
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2006
    Location
    Dutchess County,NY
    Posts
    1,052
    Quote Originally Posted by Johnsoils View Post
    bstiles,

    The Duramax diesel in the Chevrolet/GMC pickups have a 4-micron filter. Your friend might want to change the filter again in the near future to prevent unplanned downtime. I've talked to several Duramax guys this winter, they are having the most trouble that I've heard of with fuel filter waxing in the cold weather. The new 2008 Duramax are a nightmare to change the fuel filter on I'm told. I thought the 2006 was bad enough. Once spring gets here a lot of the filter issues will fade away until next winter. Good luck! John
    Regarding gelling in the Dmax,that's only because those owners were most likely not running an anti-gel additive.I've had the original LB7,the LLY,and now my LBZ version and have never gelled.I've been out overnite in -20* in Vermont--never an issue.Why? Just simple PM--I use Howes or Schaeffer anti-gel in EVERY fill-up.I change my fuel filter at 10-12K miles also.It's no picnic, but I can do it now in 15 minutes.
    Just remember when the old lady laughs at your expense for trying to sell what she thinks is a worthless piece of garbage"There is an a** for every toilet seat ever made"
    Formerly Skull-Finder-{found the skull to the famous mastodon in Hyde Park,NY in 2000

  8. #23
    Site Sponsor
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Iowa
    Posts
    72
    Quote Originally Posted by tuney443 View Post
    Regarding gelling in the Dmax,that's only because those owners were most likely not running an anti-gel additive.I've had the original LB7,the LLY,and now my LBZ version and have never gelled.I've been out overnite in -20* in Vermont--never an issue.Why? Just simple PM--I use Howes or Schaeffer anti-gel in EVERY fill-up.I change my fuel filter at 10-12K miles also.It's no picnic, but I can do it now in 15 minutes.
    We haven't had any issues at -20 below here in NE Iowa, but when we hit -35 to -40 below all heck was breaking loose around here. We have been getting heavy fuels around here all winter with high cloud points. This heavy fuel with the tighter filtration has caused problems. I've had customers using Howes, Power Service and others plug the filters this winter. I don't feel it was the fault of the anti-gel products they were using. Most anti-gels will only punch the cloud-point down -20 to -34 degrees. So with a beginning cloud point of 20 degrees, the additive can't get the cloud points down low enough for -35 to -40 below. I've got several customers and friends with the Duramax and they have had great service out of these engines, so not faulting GM or the Duramax. Thanks for the feedback. John
    "IF IT TURNS AND BURNS, IT NEEDS LUBRICATION"

    John Kahrs

    johnsoils.com

  9. #24
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    1,392
    Gee, I haven't had any problem with fuel gelling with my 08 Duramax here. Starts and runs like a Swiss watch every time.

    One can try using Kerosene or #1 diesel when the temps drop. Cheaper in the long run over using expensive additives. These fuels may be hard to find however at your local truck stop. Think I only saw a couple last year that had pumps for them in Montana or Idaho. Not sure how the warranty regards such usage.

    Another solution is to use a fuel heater ahead of the filter. I believe I saw some advertised in one or another diesel truck magazines, you know the kind, the ones that advertise 1000HP bolt on kits and nitro injection setups. If I was to run steady in a state that mandates biodiesel, like Minnesota, I think I would ad the heater and a pre-filter or strainer that was easier to service than the present filter setup.

  10. #25
    Member Deerehauler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    SW Nebraska
    Posts
    78
    I was a dispatcher for a tank truck company that would burn used oil in the fuel. The driver just left the fuel level about 4" from the top. The oil change machine would suck diesel out of the tank and would be blended with filtered used engine oil. The blend would then be pumped back into the fuel tank. The blending machine would run until the drain pan was empty. The trucks were 315 Cummins Big Cam IV's. We had no injector or pump issues in the three years I worked for them and some of the trucks had upwards of 700K miles on them.

    I would NOT do this on the newer high pressure common rail engines.

  11. #26
    Senior Member Chris5500's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2009
    Location
    Australia
    Posts
    217
    The Cummins version is called Centinel. The "Centinel Advanced Oil Management System" is an embedded system that extends oil change intervals on electronically controlled diesel engines by periodically removing a small amount of used oil from the engine's crankcase and replacing it with fresh oil. The used oil is sent to the engine's fuel tank, where it is blended with the fuel and burned during normal combustion. This system is not allowed in Australia (Even though I have seen it on engines plenty of times) due to the Fuel Quality Standards Regulations 2001 and the Fuel Standard (Automotive Diesel) Determination 2001 which can be seen here.

  12. #27
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2009
    Location
    south carolina
    Posts
    155
    Builders Transport from years ago(giving away my age) ran all it's used oil through filters and into their fuel tanks at 5 gallons per hundred gallons of fuel. they were,of course, running the manual pumps instead of electronics.
    I'm told by my dealer mechanics that it would only add lubrication to the fuel if filtered by 10 micron filters before adding.
    Last edited by carogator; 11-03-2009 at 09:27 AM. Reason: corrections

  13. #28
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Oregon
    Posts
    143
    I did this when fuel got over $4.00, 90 F250 7.3 IDI 250,000 on truck and 150,000 on pump and injectors. Used a 55 gallon barrel, 35 gallons diesel, 15 used oil. Would circulate it thru a 5 micron filter with a diaphragm pump, then a 2 micron filter when pumped into tank. The 7.3s have a fuel heater in the filter base, also the old body styles had 2 fuel tanks. I would keep clean diesel in the back tank and switch to that tank about 2-3 miles from home and start the truck on clean the next am.
    Couple times I forgot to switch tanks and there was odor and smoke, once it warmed up the smoke and odor went away. Did this for over 6 months, till fuel went back down. The engine is still running fine, never had filter issues, would never try it in something new. Pump and injectors for these things are almost free compared to new trucks.

  14. #29
    Junior Member
    Join Date
    Feb 2010
    Location
    ohio
    Posts
    18
    would the oil separate in a tank if left alone for a long time?

  15. #30
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Location
    Michigan
    Posts
    37
    EMP Corp in Escanaba, Michigan builts these systems and it is actually a pretty neat little package. www.emp-corp.com

Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •