I keep seeing these post about crane accidents. How much of that is the operator and how much is it someone else like a site supervisor? I've never run one but would love to have an old one just to have.
Rick
I keep seeing these post about crane accidents. How much of that is the operator and how much is it someone else like a site supervisor? I've never run one but would love to have an old one just to have.
Rick
Steel on steel!
A loaded question, no pun intended! IMO more often than not the operator has made some mistake in set up, or run it out of his chart on the smaller crane mishaps, but his crew can mislead him or put him in a bad spot too! On the much bigger lifts that go bad, it is more likely an engineering over sight or supervision error that put the wheels of destruction in motion. The big lifts get many more talking heads involved, and much more planning and scrutiny prior to lifting. Those operators there have much less personal involvement in many of the major decisions made about the whole heavy lift process, so they aren't the only ones that can be at fault for a miscalculation on some critical factors that cause the big disasters. Like wind loads, ground bearing pressures, range problems such as a part of a large load getting into the boom as it's approaching a critical height, tail swing problems in pick and carry lifts or load transfer when using more than one crane or a specialized spreader bar. Lift planners make these calls and aren't always right. Too bad they don't always ask they operator for his opinions before signing off on a big lift plan. Many off the lift planners have never been in the seat at all, so miss some of the most obvious things when it comes to a lift.
I'd rather be in the air running a tower crane,but can't always be so PICKY.
OK thanks that explains a lot.
Rick
Steel on steel!
I hate to say this but most are human error. what gostr8r has said is true there is a lot of hands in a big lift. I have found through experience that on the small lifts some people like to lie to their computers or was put into a bad predicament an went with it instead of telling them NO!!!, There are some accidents that it was found there was fatigue in the Iron through poor maintenance an overloading in the past. All these are variables in accidents. Or are they accidents?
apcranetraining.com has safety training for 1926.1400 standard
Well I've learned a lot from you the people who have posted stuff on here. I never thought about wind affecting a lift, ground stability or anything like that.
Thanks
Rick
Steel on steel!
The big lifts have the engineering department going batty, they want to control more than anyone should let them. I'm just an oiler, I'm not in the seat but it's easy to see just how much crap can get tossed on the operator. I was a 4 month rookie belling a 300,000 pound pick, the crane just wasn't going to make the radius the engineering department thought we could make and we found this out during the lift. Management was on the other end of the radio asking if we could push it further, my operator said not a chance in hell, so they ended up going for plan "B" which involved getting an army of laborers to fashion a landing pad for the load. Ended up hanging on to it much longer than we wanted, which isn't preferred at all, but at the end of the day, we all went home without selling a load.
What I've learned in the hoisting business (accumulated in just shy of a year after leaving the dirt scene) is that you can never be too careful. Management will always push you, but I've always been one to do things the right way. If they don't like what I'm doing, let them find someone else to hurry their way through a project. I'm not saying I'm perfect, but I won't cut corners when it really matters and judgement will go a long way. Luckily, I haven't been put in a position to choose between my job and the safe way of doing things, however that decision would be very easily made on my end.
Pin it to win it
Stick to your guns CascadeScraper! I've lost more than one job working on the contractors payrolls, and not going over and beyond the reasonable boundaries of the machines safe working limits. They hire us to do their lifts and tell us to not do anything unsafe, until it comes to interfering with their own needs and bonuses, then all bets are off. Then they want you to push it further than what the rig is capable of. That's why I like working on the owners payroll cuz he has an interest in getting his rig back intact, after each job.
I'd rather be in the air running a tower crane,
winter weather is also a forgotten factor in lifts... Ice and Snow accumulation on the boom decreases the lifting capacity... Ice is the worst..
Most crane accidents are caused by operator error. Over 70% of all crane accidents are operator error. Out of this 70% the biggest reason for these crane accidents is rigging issues. 34% to be exact. Typically it was rigged improperly or poor rigging equipment was used. It is the operators responsibility to ensure the riggers are using rigging that is compliant and safe to use. I know on some crane picks the operator can not even see the load. These statistics are coming from every crane accident as a whole. Therefore most operations the operator can see what they are lifting.
I tried to set the base for a septic pump station for a contractor one day using my old Hiab knuckle. This thing was a 8' diameter base that was 4' tall and had a 12X12' pad poured around it to decrease the ground pressure on it. When I got to the site the hole was about 15' square on the bottom in soaking wet sand and 14' deep. The top of the hole was probably closer to 50' in diameter.
When I tried to set the base I got right off the back of the truck and started to reach and my truck said "nope not doin' it". My redlight came on on the traffic light and the boom stopped. I called the office and told them what was going on. The engineers in the office figured this thing for 20k, the guys who poured it told me 23-24k, when I couldn't set it and where it stopped my boom I figured it for 27k.
The salesman in the office told the contractor over the phone that I was just scared and to tell me to use the excavator to hold down the front of the truck while I set the base. I told the contractor I was overweight and the truck physically could not set this base. Contractor believed the salesman over me and he couldn't even see the salesman. The office had another driver call me so they could get his opinion on my truck because I had told the salesman that if he didn't like the way I was running my truck to feel free to hop in his car and drive on up to the job and take over.
The other driver asked me what my chart said because the office kept telling him the weight was 20k. Even then my capacity was 20k at 20', so with the size of the hole because of the depth/digging conditions there was no way I could reach. That damn salesman even after the other driver also told him it was not possible insisted it could be done because I was just reaching over the back.
I ended up reaching forward over the body and tried to reach out and the boom shut down in that direction too! That made the contractor a believer. I ended up setting the base on the ground and they brought in a 35 tone grove to set it.
As much as a overconfident operator can be a problem, having the office screaming in your ear from 20 miles away can be just as bad. They wanted me to set that base because NO ONE wanted to have to pay for a real crane to come to the jobsite.
There's a difference between reading and comprehension.
Reading means just that you read it and when you answer it'll probably make no sense.
Comprehension means you actually understood what it said and when you answer it'll probably be on subject.
Originally Posted by CascadeScaper
Thats a big factor. Managment is ALLWAYs wanting more. You need to know when to walk away.
Good points, CraneBlogger. According to the stats, most crane accidents are caused by an operator error. But, the errors might be from being overworked, overtired and being pressured to do unsafe things by a supervisor.
Check out this article I found that breaks down the top causes of crane accidents and fatalities.
Spending my days writing about Bridge Cranes for Konecranes USA
typically it's 85-99% all operator error. you may have a few with mechanical errors, but mostly inexperienced or operators who were never trained properly.
As far as site supervisor or superintendent...rarely......but the most famous is BIG BLUE 1999 that killed 3 Iron workers. The Super insisted on proceeding on with the job...with unfavorable winds.
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