New shop

I fully understand the reason for doing it that way, but its 36' wide. not 50' or 60'. I would like to see it priced out both ways. Plus labor will be more on the pole in middle style. I just don't see the point of doing it that way.

farmerlund said:

I fully understand the reason for doing it that way, but its 36' wide. not 50' or 60'. I would like to see it priced out both ways. Plus labor will be more on the pole in middle style. I just don't see the point of doing it that way.

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A lot depends on the pitch and snow load. A free span building that can carry five feet of snow might be expensive. You may be right on the labor.

Later tonight I'll sit down and crunch numbers for a 36' free span building and see the difference. The labor will be more for a three section, but 36' trusses alone are over $6K. The point of having three sections is so I don' heat a bunch of unused space above a work area. I only need tall ceilings in the center section.

If you get a lot of snow, consider 8 in 12 or 10 in 12 pitch. You probably don't need 15 foot ceilings above your drill press and storage cabinets, so low eaves aren't that much of a disadvantage. Wood framed shops are great for do-it-yourselfers and they're much easier to insulate than a steel frame.
With that much pitch, you could probably use inexpensive 2x4 trusses on 24" centers and 2x12 rafters for the wings.

EDIT: Not sure if you are going metal or shingle roof. My comments below are thinking metal roof. I would shop another vendor for the trusses. Trusses can be a either 8' or 10' spacing with roof purlings every two feet to carry the metal. No idea what your snow load is but even at a 64 lb snow load, trusses can be found on line for about $200 ea. Even at two ft spacing that would be $4,200 and make it very easy to insulate. Just checked, Anchorage code is 40 lbs. sq. ft. snow load. Don't know what yours is where you live. You also might not have a many truss manufactures as we do to bring price down.
A 36 foot truss is a short truss in todays world and no trouble to haul. Most new garages are 36' wide today making that a very common truss. You will probably spend as much on exterior trim, rafter material, hangers, and all the stuff that goes with it building the lean to's than you will on trusses. Then you still need to strip the roof over the rafters if you are putting metal on. Plus all the extra labor. Using a 1 to 3 pitch is going to be about 6 foot higher in the center than at the edge including material thickness. A 6 in12 pitch is still only 8'-6" high in the center. If you want to bring down the outside side walls look at scissor trusses to gain some center headroom while keeping the walls down. I also think you are going to hate the interior posts in no time flat. The same amount of posts are used either way. Its a lot less wall purlings used than it will take to frame the exterior lean to walls. I agree with Delmer that with decent insulation and slab heat you do not need lowered ceilings for efficient heating.

Sorry for the ramble but might give you some other ideas to contemplate.

Rule of thumb is that 40' is the most economical width for wood. 60-70 generally for steel. I'm no expert, but that's the ball park numbers I use for pole barn type stuff.

This is what my pole barn looks like. 40x80 part with concrete, and 20' lumber for the roof the lean to's. Down here though snow load is zero, and heating isn't too big of an issue. It actually snowed yesterday, but it burned off with a couple hours of day light, the week before we were in the mid-high 70's.

https://www.heavyequipmentforums.com/threads/pictures-of-my-tired-iron.65878/

alskdjfhg said:

Rule of thumb is that 40' is the most economical width for wood. 60-70 generally for steel. I'm no expert, but that's the ball park numbers I use for pole barn type stuff.
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That's kinda what I was thinking, the pole barn system works best around that width. Now if you're sure a 12x12' door on a 16-24' wide bay is all you need, don't let me tell you otherwise. Build what you need, not what some guy on the internet says you need. I've built frames of 2x4 and 2x6 lumber to tilt up like an old barn frame only on 2-3' centers. That would work well for a smaller finished building being built on a slab.

Delmer said:

Build what you need, not what some guy on the internet says you need.

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True.

But to me, 14x14 doors sound way too small. I love my 16x25, especially now that I have a door in it and it's not just an opening.

Being able to have multiple things come in and out of the shop at once is great. Doors can't be large enough.

Something I'd also do, you have stuff like water heater, boiler waste oil storage etc, inside the shop. I wouldn't do it that, Id have a lean to sort of area on the outside of the main 40x36 or whatever.

For me, having open space is the most important thing, so stuff that's not mission critical I wouldn't put on the main shop pad area. But with the layout you posted on page 2 your already sort of doing that.

old-iron-habit said:

EDIT:
A 36 foot truss is a short truss in todays world and no trouble to haul. Most new garages are 36' wide today making that a very common truss. You will probably spend as much on exterior trim, rafter material, hangers, and all the stuff that goes with it building the lean to's than you will on trusses. Then you still need to strip the roof over the rafters if you are putting metal on. Plus all the extra labor. Using a 1 to 3 pitch is going to be about 6 foot higher in the center than at the edge including material thickness. A 6 in12 pitch is still only 8'-6" high in the center. If you want to bring down the outside side walls look at scissor trusses to gain some center headroom while keeping the walls down. I also think you are going to hate the interior posts in no time flat. The same amount of posts are used either way. Its a lot less wall purlings used than it will take to frame the exterior lean to walls. I agree with Delmer that with decent insulation and slab heat you do not need lowered ceilings for efficient heating.

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OIH and Delmer, good points indeed, thank you. Metal roof is what I planned on. I priced out the 36x40 with the split design, and also with clear span trusses. For truss companies we only have two choices up here, and I'll only deal with one. The 36x40 split design with only 16' trusses is cheaper because trusses are so expensive. But on the other hand, there's a lot more labor and spendy hardware involved with a spilt design. On top of that, my business is a one-man band so I don't have lots of time in the summer to be dinking around with custom framing details. The idea of poles in the way all the time don't sound to tempting either.
So I took several suggestions from here and decided to go with a smaller footprint(32x40), raise the ceiling to 16' all the way around, incorporate a 14x14 door, and install a mezzanine for storage. I'll put a 6' overhang off the one side to store more stuff outside but under cover. I redid my sketch to show the changes. I might put the compressor outside in a insulated doghouse under the overhang, but for now I might enclose it in it's own room with the water pressure tank/utilities.
A 36x40 shop with clear span trusses crosses the financial line for me when I think 32x40 will do. I was just in customer's shop(32x40) with my truck fixing a grader and the space felt right. I appreciate the inputs from everybody. Take a look and let me know what you think.

alskdjfhg said:

Something I'd also do, you have stuff like water heater, boiler waste oil storage etc, inside the shop. I wouldn't do it that, Id have a lean to sort of area on the outside of the main 40x36 or whatever.

For me, having open space is the most important thing, so stuff that's not mission critical I wouldn't put on the main shop pad area. But with the layout you posted on page 2 your already sort of doing that.

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The air compressor could be located outside the main shop with a little insulation I suppose, but the temps here kind of prohibit from putting the other things outside.

Build what you need said:

Ha Ha! Yeah if I did that I would be building a hanger for a couple 747s!

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Somehow I screwed up that reply meant for Delmer.

Any thoughts on putting the compressor and some other stuff that won't be used much on the mezzanine? It might be a me problem, but i have a storage space like that and I have no idea whats up there. With 16' eaves some pallet racking by the door would net a lot of storage space.

hvy 1ton said:

Any thoughts on putting the compressor and some other stuff that won't be used much on the mezzanine? It might be a me problem, but i have a storage space like that and I have no idea whats up there. With 16' eaves some pallet racking by the door would net a lot of storage space.

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If I could somehow effectively insulate the compressor noise and vibration, I would rather do that than put it outside.

Numbfingers said:

but the temps here kind of prohibit from putting the other things outside.

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Didn't even look at your location, yeah I can get why youd want everything inside in your area.

The most recent layout your posted looks pretty decent to me.

IF I can hijack for 1 question please.. sandblaster.. put closest to air compressor, {other side of the wall} OR it wont matter as long as I run 3/4" pipe to it??

thepumpguysc said:

IF I can hijack for 1 question please.. sandblaster.. put closest to air compressor, {other side of the wall} OR it wont matter as long as I run 3/4" pipe to it??

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http://www.parker.com/Literature/Literature Files/pneumatic/serv/TEC-15.pdf

That's what google comes up with for pipe sizing for flow and pressure reduction. What pressure and flow does the sand blaster need? I'm at school without any engineering books, so can't double check their figures.

That chart is based on a 10% pressure loss for pipe below 3/4" and 5% loss above 3/4", per 100' of run.

THANK YOU.. that's VERY helpful & just what I needed.. you da' man..

thepumpguysc said:

IF I can hijack for 1 question please.. sandblaster.. put closest to air compressor, {other side of the wall} OR it wont matter as long as I run 3/4" pipe to it??

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The bottom line is the farther the distance, the larger size pipe you have to use to get the same air flow. So it is a trade off of convenience vs. material cost.

Numbfingers said:

If I could somehow effectively insulate the compressor noise and vibration, I would rather do that than put it outside.

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Air compressors can get hot as hell in enclosed places. They are air-cooled.

One thing that I haven't seen here; I know you do not worry about permits, but....
Last week a fellow blew his shop up and did a pretty good job on himself, he was working on a car in his shop with a wood stove. and obviously; gas vapors got to the warm toasty stove with open flame and bang. Gasoline fumes rise up to 18" according to the NEC, so think about what type of work you do and where your heat will be located. My furnace and ducting hangs as high as possible.