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Is a crane boom a suspended load?

Kiwi-truckwit

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Nov 20, 2016
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New Zealand
Hey people, I'm just after an opinion on this. At the moment I'm working on a small site with an all terrain crane. The site foreman has stated that the boom is a suspended load and nobody may walk under it, even if the crane is not in use. Now, if I had a load on the hook, then fair enough maybe, but I fail to see the logic in this policy, especially considering that I'm in the middle of a site and working 360deg, plus the fact that I only have a max radius of 24m but a boom length of 39m, with high rise on 3 sides and a congested 5 lane road on the 4th. If they're that concerned about a boom collapse, then surely we should be evacuating the buildings and closing the roads!
I'd be interested to see your views
 

sheepfoot

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wilmington nc
Safety safety safety, if it has anything on the hook sure, and its a good practice to not walk/stand under any raised attachment, most all hydraulic cranes have a load check in the boom cylinders and outriggers. Short of the ground giving way and it landing on it's side, he is just covering safety (told you so). They just had a fire service ladder/tower tip over (outrigger pushed in the ground while the boom was extended out over the side) came to the ground with two firefighters in the basket. Firehouse.com Things happen all the time and we have to be aware of whats going on around us. He should bring this up on the next safety meeting with all personal and subs.
 

Kiwi-truckwit

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Nov 20, 2016
Messages
315
Location
New Zealand
Safety safety safety, if it has anything on the hook sure, and its a good practice to not walk/stand under any raised attachment, most all hydraulic cranes have a load check in the boom cylinders and outriggers. Short of the ground giving way and it landing on it's side, he is just covering safety (told you so). They just had a fire service ladder/tower tip over (outrigger pushed in the ground while the boom was extended out over the side) came to the ground with two firefighters in the basket. Firehouse.com Things happen all the time and we have to be aware of whats going on around us. He should bring this up on the next safety meeting with all personal and subs.
Yes things happen, but the risks hAve been identified, assessed and controlled so as to make the event of an overturn or failure unlikely. That being said, I still believe it is at least imptactical, if not impossible, to stay out of the fall zone of any crane boom in the city. Suspended loads, we'll obviously it's dangerous, stupid and (at least down here) illegal to hoist a load over people or occupied buildings/plant, but is/should be the boom be included in that?
 

Tractorguy

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NC
I feel like it would be. Let's say not just on a crane but a machine. If a boom is up in the air regardless off lockouts or not it's still considered a "suspended" load anything is possible.
 

CM1995

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Alabama
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Running what I brung and taking what I win
I feel like it would be. Let's say not just on a crane but a machine. If a boom is up in the air regardless off lockouts or not it's still considered a "suspended" load anything is possible.

Well if that were the case then the power co's bucket truck is also a suspended load which would limit what they could swing over like houses, cars, buildings, etc to repair power lines.

Change the regulation, add more safety police and we'll never get our power turned back on.:cool:
 

digger242j

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• Part Number: 1926
• Part Title: Safety and Health Regulations for Construction
• Subpart: CC
• Subpart Title: Cranes & Derricks in Construction
• Standard Number: 1926.1401
• Title: Definitions.
• GPO Source: e-CFR


https://www.osha.gov/pls/oshaweb/owadisp.show_document?p_table=STANDARDS&p_id=13

Load refers to the object(s) being hoisted and/or the weight of the object(s); both uses refer to the object(s) and the load-attaching equipment, such as, the load block, ropes, slings, shackles, and any other ancillary attachment.

I'd say that says no, the boom isn't a "suspended load."
 

crane operator

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sw missouri
Kiwi isn't in the states, so I don't think OSHA has much bearing on his problem (although it is a good rule). I think his main problem is the site supervisor, and who's paying his wages. If your working directly for him, or he is the general contractors representitive, and he decides its a suspended load, then you better treat it as such, or find somewhere else to put your crane.

If the boom really is a suspended load, and you carry it to the extreme, then yes, everything in your entire swing radius would have to be evacuated, and I don't think they want to pay all the other nearby buildings occupants to leave, while you're building your building.

It becomes a touchy subject, and how far you want to push things. If you don't mind the antagonism, and want to push it, make him put his opinions on paper, in a set of written rules for you, then follow them. Sometimes bullies back off, because they don't want anything pointed towards them, or responsibility. They just want to be able to say "I told you so" afterwards.

About the time you put danger tape up around your entire swing radius, and demand that no one enter that area, because the crane might fall on them, then sometimes sanity enters the picture. The crane is held up by steel pins and hydro oil, so yes it can fall. You could say the same of the building, its just steel and bolts, and maybe they shouldn't be inside a uncompleted building either, because it might fall.:rolleyes:

I have, many times, lifted loads over buildings that are occupied by people. Its not feasable to ask everyone to leave the sheriffs department building, or the local hospital, while I put a new hvac unit on the roof. Department stores, grocery stores and gas stations, all stay open while I'm working there. In a downtown setting, they don't evacuate a 15 story office building full of insurance workers, while they're working on the roof, its just not economically feasable to tell all those people to stay home for the day. That's reality, not some pie in the sky perfect world.

HVAC unit, 4' in the air, and I was in a hurry to get it set and get to the next job, and the worker on the ground couldn't get the shipping/ boards strapping out from under the unit. I hopped out of the crane, walked over, got under it and pulled out the boards. He looked at me in horror "THAT UNIT could FALL on you!" my reply-- "if I really thought that unit could fall, it wouldn't leave the ground". I'm all about safety, and I'm glad people are more concerned than they used to be about such things. Can a suspended item fall? yes, Is it likely? no. Do I have some death wish? no. But we do have a job to do.

I'm kind of a pain with lift plans. Some big general contractors (I'm sure its their ins. companys, or "saftey" providers idea), have started to require them for all lifts. I have my own version of a lift plan, but some make me use their own "version". One contractor has a 70% rule, anything over 70% of capacity becomes a "critical pick" and means more paperwork. I like to pull their chain a little, because the one supervisor is difficult, so I raised a fuss about what 70% is, before I would calculate the plan. Is it 70% of capacity of the crane, or 70% of the chart #? (which is already 85% of capacity). You want to make a saftey man get a deer in the headlights look, tell him HE has to decide which # it is, because they are totally different figures (it can be 70% of 100%, or 70% of 85%). He doesn't have any idea, just that he needs the paperwork filled out to put in his drawer, and check the box that he did his job today.

safety officer.jpg
 

digger242j

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Kiwi isn't in the states, so I don't think OSHA has much bearing on his problem (although it is a good rule).

Yeah, I forgot that until just now when I went back to the top of the thread.

Just came back from a trip to town, where I saw a sit e with a couple of tower cranes set up. I couldn't help thinking of a pair of windshield wipers, swinging back and forth, chasing all the ground personnel to the edges of the site as they worked...
 

Kiwi-truckwit

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Nov 20, 2016
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New Zealand
Thanks for your input guys. Good to know I'm not the only one who finds this ridiculous.
In New Zealand, we used to work under OSH rules. After the Pike River mining disaster several years back, where 29 men were killed in an underground coal mine explosion, the health & safety act was overhauled and a new governing body formed, called Worksafe. There is a lot of misinformation and scare mongering about this new act, and some people are going a little overboard with safety, mainly to cover their own arses.

This particular site, it's the construction manager for the principal contractor that is being difficult. The site is still in the foundation stage, which is being undertaken by a subcontractor foundation specialist, who often uses our crane services. The principal company has their own tower, crawler, and small rough terrain hydraulic cranes, and the stance on the booms is not shared by their own policy, nor by the NZ crane association. However, the resulting decision on this site is that if I'm not lifting, the boom is to be retracted. Little bit annoying with 40m of pinned boom being used, but it is what it is.
 

Kiwi-truckwit

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New Zealand
Lift plans.... Around here, every lift requires a lift plan. That, and evidence of a vehicle pre-start inspection, are the first things asked for when a Worksafe inspector visits your site. Our crane capacity charts are all ISO, which is 75%. Different sites have different requirements, but typically anything over 80% of rated capacity becomes a "complex lift". It's normally easy to tweak the numbers though.... Nobody ever asks to see the load charts. Their eyes normally boggle though when they see the size of the folder in a pinned boom crane with multiple counterweight combinations!
Oh, before I forget, the site in question is having a tower crane erected in the near future....I wonder what will happen to this "policy" then?!
 

crane operator

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sw missouri
I figured it would be a site manager thing. He's just trying to make things look good. You're options are pretty limited- do what he says, leave, or have the guys you're working for, whine bi$%^ and complain to the site manager's boss, that he's being a imbecile, and then deal with him being mad at you for the rest of the job. And then you might not have to scope boom back in and out all the time.

You might ask to see their crane policy, "just to make sure I'm complying correctly, with what you want":).

But ultimately it's their site, and their $, so you're probably going to play by their rules.


crane capacity charts are all ISO, which is 75%. Different sites have different requirements, but typically anything over 80% of rated capacity becomes a "complex lift"

It's this kind of stuff that burns me up. Let's take a crane that is already derated/ charted at 75%. And lets add another 20% deduct to that (you can hear them in a office somewhere-- 80% sounds safe- lets pick that #:rolleyes:). Now we've effectively made most cranes run at 65% of capacity, just for safety margin. Which is fine, but no one wants the reality of now we're doing 50 ton crane work with 100 ton capacity cranes, and all the increased costs that comes with that. No one wants you to increase your bid to comply with their "crane rules".
 

Kiwi-truckwit

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New Zealand
I figured it would be a site manager thing. He's just trying to make things look good. You're options are pretty limited- do what he says, leave, or have the guys you're working for, whine bi$%^ and complain to the site manager's boss, that he's being a imbecile, and then deal with him being mad at you for the rest of the job. And then you might not have to scope boom back in and out all the time.

You might ask to see their crane policy, "just to make sure I'm complying correctly, with what you want":).

But ultimately it's their site, and their $, so you're probably going to play by their rules.




It's this kind of stuff that burns me up. Let's take a crane that is already derated/ charted at 75%. And lets add another 20% deduct to that (you can hear them in a office somewhere-- 80% sounds safe- lets pick that #:rolleyes:). Now we've effectively made most cranes run at 65% of capacity, just for safety margin. Which is fine, but no one wants the reality of now we're doing 50 ton crane work with 100 ton capacity cranes, and all the increased costs that comes with that. No one wants you to increase your bid to comply with their "crane rules".
Exactly. Which is why I always say, "safety when it suits". The sorts that are preaching safety the loudest, (and God help anyone they catch not complying) are usually the first to take shortcuts when it is beneficial to them.
I like to think I'm fairly safety minded, and to me, the biggest contribution to a safe workplace is a strong safety culture with buy in from all involved. A dictatorship is seldom going to get the desired result, especially when it's paired with a "do as I say, not as I do" kind of mentality.
 

Knepptune

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Indiana
Reminds me of a job we were asked to bid on.

Forget the exact numbers but I believe it was 70k unload off a truck. Pick load up, truck pulls out from under load, set load down. Possible to do it with a 50t. But no, needed 10' safety margin between crane and trailer, had to have 40' clearance between boom head and load. And since it was over 40k it was a critical pick and you could only use 70% of chart capacity. Ended up with a lift plan for a 130t crane. But it's their site, their money, their rules.

We didn't have enough crane for the job.

Instead of scoping the boom in and out all day will they let you get by with booming up to max boom angle and swinging directly over the front of the crane. Seems like that would only be 15-20' directly in front of the crane that's under the "suspended load"?
 

Kiwi-truckwit

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They possibly would, but since I'm only doing a few lifts a day, I'm just leaving it sucked in until they need it. 7am start on site, and it's generally not until 1 or 2pm that they're ready. Swing a couple of 50' pile cages into their bored holes, hook onto a tremme pipe for the concrete pour, and it's home time. Got another week or two of this yet.
 

CM1995

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Exactly. Which is why I always say, "safety when it suits". The sorts that are preaching safety the loudest, (and God help anyone they catch not complying) are usually the first to take shortcuts when it is beneficial to them.

I'm not in the crane business but I can relate with what you said.

Worked on a condo project where the super was a safety nazi until it came to a portion of the work they were self performing - then it was no holds barred to get it done whatever it took.:rolleyes:

However he would nit pick everything we did as a subcontractor.
 

Kiwi-truckwit

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New Zealand
I'm not in the crane business but I can relate with what you said.

Worked on a condo project where the super was a safety nazi until it came to a portion of the work they were self performing - then it was no holds barred to get it done whatever it took.:rolleyes:

However he would nit pick everything we did as a subcontractor.
It's amazing how quickly a blind eye can be turned when it suits!
Weather permitting, all the deep piles should be done early next week and I can demobe from site... This job is also out of town so I'm away from home all week, so I'll certainly be looking forward to the end of this one.
Reminds me of a job we were asked to bid on.

Forget the exact numbers but I believe it was 70k unload off a truck. Pick load up, truck pulls out from under load, set load down. Possible to do it with a 50t. But no, needed 10' safety margin between crane and trailer, had to have 40' clearance between boom head and load. And since it was over 40k it was a critical pick and you could only use 70% of chart capacity. Ended up with a lift plan for a 130t crane. But it's their site, their money, their rules.

We didn't have enough crane for the job.
That reminds me of a job a few years back, dismantling a gas fired turbine in a power station a few years back. The client required extra controls to be put in place for picks over 80% of capacity, including sign off by the station manager and an engineer. We had a large crane on site with one truckload of counterweight on it, when doing the lift plan for the heaviest pick of the job, the calcs came to just over the 80%, so it was easier to just get another load of weights brought in, which of course raised the hire rate. Everybody was happy, but I still thought it was a little overkill.
 

Operator4100

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I was on a job in the Carolinas a few years back another subcontractor was there and on his hard hat he had a sticker which said (common sense is not common no more), I thought boy ain't that the truth
 

Birken Vogt

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I was on a job in the Carolinas a few years back another subcontractor was there and on his hard hat he had a sticker which said (common sense is not common no more), I thought boy ain't that the truth

Can't have that sticker on your hard hat, it might cover a crack or other damage.
 

old-iron-habit

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Moose Lake, MN
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It's this kind of stuff that burns me up. Let's take a crane that is already derated/ charted at 75%. And lets add another 20% deduct to that (you can hear them in a office somewhere-- 80% sounds safe- lets pick that #:rolleyes:). Now we've effectively made most cranes run at 65% of capacity, just for safety margin. Which is fine, but no one wants the reality of now we're doing 50 ton crane work with 100 ton capacity cranes, and all the increased costs that comes with that. No one wants you to increase your bid to comply with their "crane rules"./QUOTE/
I agree that safety officials and insurance companies get a little nutso in there policies. However there is a difference between doing the critical lift paperwork on close to capacity lifts and having to get a bigger crane. I had to sign off along with the crews on all critical lifts for years. In the last fifteen years before I retired, twice we as a team, while doing the paperwork found mistakes in the pick plan that would have over loaded the capacity of the crane had the pick been made as originally planned. One was in a bad spot on a building, the other was picking off a truck that could come no closer. Would either have caused a problem or a dropped load or perhaps drifted and crushed someone, or damaged property. The very qualified operator would have probably felt it was to heavy and stopped. But we will never know because we figured it out on paper before the pick was made. I hated filling out the paperwork and doing the math but the folks that paid me wanted it and so it was.
 

td25c

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indiana
Now we've effectively made most cranes run at 65% of capacity, just for safety margin. Which is fine, but no one wants the reality of now we're doing 50 ton crane work with 100 ton capacity cranes, and all the increased costs that comes with that. No one wants you to increase your bid to comply with their "crane rules"

Good point old-iron-habit .
Then again if you look at the load charts on a modern crane today they start inside the outriggers . What's up with that ?

Could easily make a proven 50 crane look like a 100 ton rig on paper to some feller setting behind a desk trying to make a decision adding to the confusion ?
 
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