Dump trailer suggestion

[snonut12]

Hey, first time posting here but I'm sure most of you are familar with me. ;) Anyway here's the story: I currently have a 6x10 low profile 7000# dump trailer which is one of my best investment. However I am having a couple problems involving with ground clearance and limited capacity. It seems that the local manufacturer of my trailer has put the pivot points a bit too far away from the rear end of bed (18") so when dumping fully loaded, the bed will bottom out and it's not easy getting my truck to drag until the load is out. This is especially a serious problem when dumping on grass/field because I can only dump halfway before it will touch the ground. Another problem is I can only haul 2 yards, maybe 3 of top soil or gravel. So I'm pushing the limit when carrying a bit more than that. Although most of times I use the trailer for brush and leaves removal I still could use the extra capacity for the heavy stuff.

So I am thinking about something like 6x12 with 10K-12K GVWR. I thought that a deckover would be the solution for ground clearance issue but then I realized that could be another problem: high center of gravity. After doing some researching through some trailer manufacturers I noticed that some has low profile with the bed being a bit higher than mine (around 3" higher) and by photos some has pivot points closer to rear end of bed. I thought about the one that has ladder ramps that can be stored under the bed. So I think 2-in-1 trailer sound good to me, in case in future I want to haul equipment like skid steer. Thought it'd be better to buy bigger than what I need now and then later find out to be too small again.

I've looked at a few manufacturers like Bri-Mar and Cam Superline and am sure there are more of them. What do you have and what would you recommend? Thanks. :D

[badranman]

I have a 6x12 low profile 6 ton dump trailer. It's a Weberlane made in Ontario. It's built like a brick s@#thouse. I have no problem raising the bed to dump it. Like you mentioned it is very versatile. It will hold my 763 skidsteer or my 328 mini-x. There are so many trailer manufacturers out there, must be close to 8 in my little province alone, it's hard for someone far away to recommend one. I can legally carry about 8000 lbs, illlegally (sp) 12 000 lbs. :naughty . Of course no sense having this without a truck with the balls to tow it. I have 2 2500hds both with the Duramax. I don't know if this helped you at all. :beatsme

[Steve Frazier]

What's the GCVWR of your truck? DOT has been working heavy around here lately pulling anyone in that looks suspect. Make sure your truck is rated to pull the weight you have in mind.

[cat320]

I have a cam 6x12 bobcat/dumpt trailer there 5 ton model and it has plenty of clearence to dump .I have have had everything in there loam,stone,regular dirt sand and my skid which weighs in at 6250 lbs . It hauls it fine and dumps good so if you want something like that you don't have to get the deck over if you still would like to carry equipment.

[snonut12]

I checked for GCWR on the door sticker but found nothing so I looked up the owner manual and it said for my 6.0L gasser that the max. is 16K. I am aware that mine can only tow up to 10K but I'd hate to buy another trailer again in future if the demand continue to go up (would be the 3rd time!). If it does I would be getting a Duramax and it would be nice to have one less thing to worry about during purchase because I would already have the trailer that it can pull at full capacity. Duramax truck has GCWR of 22K however the manual state that they can only pull up to 12K trailer, including the 5th wheel. So right now even though I am limited to 10K I think it'd be a better choice to get the 12K? I understand that I'd have to get CDL to legally tow it.

Keep the suggestions coming in! :thumbsup

[cat320]

When you buy the trailer have them down rate it from 12K to 10Kor9,999 That is what one trailer place said they would dow for me when i was looking .

[snonut12]

Rick, I've heard similar thing from someone who said that a dealer could re-tag the trailer. But once the trailer leave the dealer lot can it be re-tagged again in future? My guess would be probably not?

[cat320]

Stephen I think you could retag after it's only paper.But some trailers just by changing the tires the rating goes up ,the rest of the trailer is all ready built up with the springs and axels and stuff but they put a lesser weight tire capacity on and that brings the rating down I have seen on the web trailers that both have 6K lb axels but have different ratings. If you have a good trailer place near you just ask them or tell them what your palning on doing and they should be able to advise you better.

[snonut12]

I called the local dealer and asked for some base pricings. While I was talking with them I asked about re-tagging the trailer. They did not give a definite answer but it sounds like it is possible. I am planning to get CDL anyway so I'm not going to worry about re-tagging.

Their base pricing for Cam Superline 6x12 LP HD with 12K rating is $6195. This include slide out 7K ladder ramps, two cylinders, barn doors, 7K jack and pintle. How does that compare to what you paid? I think the recent high cost of steel are partial to blame.

[cat320]

I paid $5 for the same thing . I have still seen the same one out in belchertown MA for less than what I paid it sounds kinda high for me but the steel price could be doing something to up it but I would call another cam dealer just to keep them honest so to speak.

[cat320]

Stephen I was woundering fi your gonna get that one www.Mainetrailer.com has the cam just for the fun of it give them a call they have a toll free number. You might just save $1,500 maybe

[xkvator]

www.Mainetrailer.com
i like the "now open in auburn" that follows your mouse around :bouncegri

[chipsearthworks]

I have a 6ft X 12 ft mortiz dump trailer with the ramp package,low profile,3 way tailgate and I love it this thing is built pretty freking strong. I bought it from a place in Mass named Orchard Trailers. I think there web site is www.moritz.com i think not sure though

[glsahl]

Hope I'm not getting oof subject.Does anyone have experience with "side dump" trailers?
We are putting our '83 Pete back into service,and are shopping for a 50T,detachable gooseneck lowboy,and a 24yd or better end dump,or side dump.Dump trailer has to be good for sand,type II,or spoils/junk asphalt.We had a double hopper belly dump,when we first got the truck,we were doing alot of grading jobs then,now we are sticking to underground stuff,and I'm not sure a side dump is much better than a belly,end dumps around here are scarce,and expensive,$41-47K,new,4-6 weeks from order.Side dumps are a little better,but,we're not sure they are as useful.I'd be grateful for any input.

[snonut12]

Rick, thanks for that link. I sent them an email but it was returned to me undeliverable so I'll try and give them a call. I also emailed another local dealer but they never got back to me so I guess I'll have to give them a call too so I can see if their price is in line with the one I told earlier. Chip, that link led to a different site so I did a quick google search and found the one you're talking about. Wow, beefy looking trailer.

Will 12' be long enough for a skid steer with attachment like a snowblower, snowplow, rotary broom, etc? Thanks.

[Cat420]

12 feet is going to be tight. Your best best bet would be to measure the exact setup that would be going on the trailer.

Not related to dump trailers, but this website has some of the toughest looking equipment trailers that I've seen. http://overbilttrailers.com/

[cat320]

Stephen if your gonna be putting any kind of attachemnt on there I would get the longer one oh and get the wider option one it is hard to tie it down with the 6' model.

[chipsearthworks]

{"Chip, that link led to a different site so I did a quick google search and found the one you're talking about. Wow, beefy looking trailer." }

Yeah sorry about that The site Is www.moritzinternational.com this one should work I hope the last one I click on it and It came up with some wierd site sorry about that guys. Also a 12 ft is tight like a few people said will it work, yes. would a bigger one work, sure would. They make a 14ft dumper now If they had it when I bought mine3 years ago I would of gotten that one but 12ft is the biggest they had. It works great for me fits a skid in there perfectly if I need any bigger equipment I just call up my friend with a 20 ton trailer and he drops it off for me.

[snonut12]

Thanks - after receiving comments about tight fit I went and checked out on 14' dump trailers from a few manufacturers and unforunately I think it may not be the best option. It seems that 14' is very heavy thus meaning less carrying capacity. I've seen a couple that has empty weight of 4,000# and the price tag is very high. So for now I think that 12' would be the best choice. Perhaps I could put the attachments on bed of my truck? If the business in future expands, then I would get an equipment trailer.

I noticed that Cam Superline 12K rated dump trailer only have 15" D rated tires. I think that is pathetic. Most other manufacturers with 12K capacity has 16" tires. Cat320, what size tire are on yours? I don't see any upgrade option for 16" on their website, but is it available?

By the way I called Maine Trailer and unfortunately it appears that they are higher priced. They quoted $600 higher for the standard duty 6x12 and said they do not stock or won't even order the 6x12 HD version. Interesting. I also gave another local dealer a ring and was quoted just about the same ($6000) as the first local dealer that I got quote from. So from my viewpoint my local dealers are in line. BriMar seems to be higher priced than Cam, and weigh more. But the interesting part is their equipment trailer are much cheaper than Cam.

I will also continue to pursue and search into other manufacturers, but would like to try and keep it local. Anyone have a positive experience with Big Tex trailers?

[cat320]

I have never dealt with maine trailer but they are always adv. about trailer tags for $30 a year and so on I thought they would be cheaper but always good to make a few calls.There is a place in bealchertown MA that sells cam and I always see them advtise my trailer for 4999 but who knows might just be a gimminc to get you in .I don't have there number .My tires are 15" and axels are 5200 some 12K trailers have 6K axels with the 16" .I would get the wider option if you can 6' is just to tight when you have to get to the d rings to tie it down.

[snonut12]

I don't know but could it be possible that you were looking at the regular duty Cam 6x12 with 12K rating? They are built the same as the HD 6x12 except that the HD has a few extras like two telescope cylinders and barn doors, etc. The price you mention is about the same as what I was quoted from two local dealers (around $5000) for the regular duty model.

Just out of curiously I decided to check with my original trailer dealer/manufacturer (Heavy Hauler) on their pricing. They are the closest trailer dealer and they actually build trailers unlike the other two local dealers that I've been checking with pricing, which only sell major brand trailers like Cam Superline and BriMar, etc. Anyway I checked on their pricing and I should say there is quite a difference in pricing. I could get 6'5"x12', 26" wall, 11 gauge steel floor and walls, 16" tires and 12K rating for $5,300. However the barn doors, ramps, stake pockets, D-rings are an option which is additional $$. They really do build good trailers with good materials.

You probably are wondering why I am looking at them with the fact of problems I've been having with my current 7000# Heavy Hauler dump trailer? Like I mentioned earlier in this thread one of the reason the bed is bottoming out is because of distance from the pivot point to rear end of bed. I was going to ask the manufacturer if they could have put the pivot point closer to the rear end but I figured it was engineering design because they probably want pivot point to be closer to the axle to help take some of weight when dumping full loaded. Also I noticed that some other manufacturers that has axles more closer to the rear end of trailer which would helps when dumping. I looked at mine and I think I just realized the reason why mine is bottoming out so easily. Mine has the axles just about centered. I'm attaching a picture of mine when it was bought a few years ago. Do you think this is the problem? If so, then maybe I could talk to the manufacturer and ask if they could put the axles furthur back and maybe raise the bed height a couple inches by using deeper pivot brackets. I think that it would work. What do you think?

[snonut12]

Notice how close the bed is to the solid ground when fully raised UNLOADED. :eek2

[Steve Frazier]

If you set the axles back, you'll increase the tongue weight of the trailer, perhaps beyond the hitch capacity. By centering the axles on the trailer, the axles carry the load rather than your truck. What you would need is stiffer springs rather than moving the axle.

Putting the pivot point of the dump closer to the hoist fulcrum as pictured reduces the load on the hoist and the frame under it. The pivot point of the body could be moved to the rear, but the trailer might require a heavier capacity hoist and additional strengthening where the hoist is mounted.

[cat320]

Stephen my trailer is the HD one twin cylenders barn doors and 4 D rings My trailer does not bottom out like yours does but id does have all that stuff you mention was an option from the other guy .I don't think they are that cheap if they have to add all that stuff ,then it will bring the price to the same as the others. I also think that your hitch may be set to high which would make the dump angle hit to but it could just be the way the pick was taken.

[snonut12]

Steve, you're right that moving back axles will increase tongue weight, but it seems that most other dump trailer manufacturers I've seen has axles moved back. How comes do they design that? I guess it mean they have stiffer springs? I understand that on dump trailer the load are spreaded out evenly but on equipment trailer which has axles set back you put the heavier part of equipment over the axles. So again, why do most dump trailer manufacturers have the axles set back?

Rick, I know your is the HD version but I just thought that the one you drove by could be the regular duty version, sorry. You're right, my ball mount is set a little too high. I like it set a bit high so that way the trailer will be level when fully loaded instead of pointing down which is unsafe. By my eyes it look fine but when I measured the height of trailer bed front and rear, there is 4" of a difference. I am surprised and even if i have set it level I still might have ground clearance problem because of axles being centered and the pivot point too far from the rear end. Did you pulled it with your Chevy 2500HD (at least I think that's what you had?). How did it handled when pulling load evenly spreaded at capacity (or near capacity)?

[cat320]

I had mine set just a little higher too the back end as i just measured it was around 15" I took some pics but just could not get them sized right to put on here with out them being to small to see. Mt chevy pulled it fine when loaded but most of the time I think i was at or above the load limit but she did dump every time . If you want to see them and resize them I can email them too you.

[badranman]

My 6 ton Weberlane has the axles set back as well. It also has dual cylinders which in my opinion is a must have.

[snonut12]

Here's a few pictures of Rick's Cam trailer that I resized for him. ;)

[snonut12]

Rick, your trailer looks good. Thanks for sharing the pics with us. ;) 15" of ground clearnce is pretty impressive comparing to mine. :yup Only thing I still don't like is the 15" D rated tires on a 12K trailer. :eek2 Most other manufacturers I've checked has 15" D rated on 10K, but for the exact same trailer, they can put 16" E rated on which will raise GVWR to 12K. So my feeling is that Cam is pushing the limit. I think having a smaller tires & wheels is one of reason Cam is cheaper than some others with 16".

[cat320]

Stephen ,I called cam up a while back that trailer is rated to haul 8K lbs and I too looked at the tires and they are rated to carry alot of weight from the side wall rateings, but you have to rmember that trailer tire that are 15" are alot stronger than a car tire i'm sure you know this I sound like an ass telling you.For the money I think it was a good bang for the buck .The PJ trailers look good too but they are at the $6-7K range . If you look at the tomaster dumps now they are no where near the way they used to be they changed there line up.I was looking at the foster trailers when they where there own entity and the dealer wanted like $8-9 and another $1k for a hydraulic jack. It's hard because one co has one thing more or less but i guess what you need to look for is the axels fram and what gauge steel is used for floor and walls .Also for the bobcat ramps so put them so they are mounted on the underside of the body that ok i guess untill you have to cycle that extra weight up and down.but over all I think getting a dump trailer is the best way to fly for little to moderate use for less of the cost of getting a dump truck.

[snonut12]

I just would like to say thank you for your time and effort to participate in this thread. I've learned alot and it has helped me narrow down my options. I had it down to two models and made some calls for pricing. After I got the pricing, I did the math and add up the options and tax, but in end it has gotten too much. Unfortunatley it would cost me $8K to $8.5K for a 12K rated trailer with options that I want. I have not figured out yet how much my dump trailer is worth right now but my guess would be around $2500. So that mean I'd be paying extra $6K which is still way too much for something that I have already invested in. Because I get a job from time to time, I really dont make that much and it'd take forever to make up for the extra cost. Most of times I use the trailer for hauling away brush or leaves so weight is not really a problem. But when delivering top soil I am limited to 2 or 3 yards but I get only a few requests per year so it's not really worth to pursue into bigger dump trailer. I can live with the little inconvience and deal with it.

However I still would like a trailer to haul skid steer and who know, maybe compact tractor with attachment like front end loader and rotary mower. And perhaps a mini excavigator. I currently have a 6 1/2' x 12' 3500# landscape trailer that I could sell and get an equipment trailer. I just don't know how to decide which size and rating to get. Available to me are 16' and 20' models with 6'7" width in either 10K or 12K rating. Which size and rating would you recommend for the applications that I mentioned above? Pricing is not a factor for this time since ET is pretty much affordable ($2500 to $3000). Thanks. :salute

[cat320]

Well I just got a quote for a down east trailer 16' long 9999 gvw for $3,500 my freind just got a tomaster c10 16" for $4,500

[Steve Frazier]

I paid $4500 for my equipment trailer in 2000. They aren't as cheap as you think

[snonut12]

This is the actual pricing from my local trailer manufacturer, Heavy Hauler. Since they sell directly to me, the cost is much lower. They really do build good trailers, it's just their design of dump trailer that I did not like. I'd appreciate any recommendation on size and rating of trailer. Thanks.

[Electra_Glide]

Which size and rating would you recommend for the applications that I mentioned above?
Bigger is always better... :drinkup

But...(there's always a but). Issues of licensing, GCWR, and proper vehicle plates have already been mentioned in this thread. All those things cost money above and beyond the cost of the trailer. And like Steve mentioned, getting stopped by the DOT without having all your ducks in a row is priceless... :crying

A 9999 GVW trailer has enough payload capacity (7000-8000 lbs) to handle anything but the largest skidsteers, and will also handle most 3-ton mini-excavators and compact tractors. You don't need a CDL, and you don't need combination plates (at least in PA). Also sounds like your current truck will pull it.

Personally, this is the likely route I'm taking.

Pricing is not a factor for this time since ET is pretty much affordable ($2500 to $3000). Thanks. :salute
Around here you can get an 18' 9999 GVW equipment trailer for about $3000 plus tax and registration

[snonut12]

Ok thanks. Would the 16' be sufficient?

[snonut12]

Just wondering if the stake pockets can be used as a tie down point for chains or should D-rings be used?

[Steve Frazier]

I guess it would depend on how heavy they are. I use the ones on my equipment trailer exclusively to tie my machine down.

[cat320]

They should be fine long as they are a good thickness .I have used them on other trailers that i have used .

[snonut12]

If I get a trailer with GVWR of 12K (for example), can it be legally registered for 10K? I do not know what the law in NYS allow about registering below the manufacturer's GVWR. Or would I need to have the manufacturer/dealer change the paperwork down to 10K?

[chipsearthworks]

If I get a trailer with GVWR of 12K (for example), can it be legally registered for 10K? I do not know what the law in NYS allow about registering below the manufacturer's GVWR. Or would I need to have the manufacturer/dealer change the paperwork down to 10K?


I know in ct you can just because thats how mine is registered, it is actully rated for 12k but because it weighs in at around 2300 empty i had it registered for 10k. I think they(dmv) do not mind when you derate what you can legally carry i am guessing that they hate when you register it for more then it can carry if you get my drift. Plus by registering it for 10k you might not need to get a CDL class A, I know in CT any trailer that carrys more then 10k needs a CDL class A. hope this helps.

[cat320]

Well i lowered mine to 10K from the 11,900 that it is or 12 if your the dmv lol
the amount of times i will carry above that would be slim even with the bobcat in it.I think long as you don't say for exmple you have a 20K gvw gooseneck and you lower it to 10K then load it to the max capacity of the 20K

[Orchard Ex]

Be careful on "derating" trailers. Here in MD the MVA goes by whatever is on the VIN plate for GVWR as far as the class of license you need and by your registration as far as what weight you can carry. Example - There is no trailer registration weight here between 10k and 20k so most folks with a 14k trailer register it for 10k to pay the lower amount for the tags. However if you get pulled over and the VIN plate says 14k GVWR you had better have a class A license (private or CDL) no matter that you are only registered for 10k. Many of the trailer companies will put a 10k VIN plate on a 14k trailer if you request it, but you can still only (legally) carry 10k load and trailer combined so you are wasting 2 tons of load.
Check with your DMV to see if they will go by the VIN or the registration as to the class of license you need.

[snonut12]

Sounds like I could register it lower at 10K but I better find out for sure about the CDL part. You brought up a good point. Actually I just pulled out the NYS CDL manual and here is what it said:

".... provided that the gross vehicle weight rating (GVWR) or GCWR of vehicle(s) being towed is more than 10,000lbs."

From this wording it appears that if the manufacturer GVWR tag is over 10K then I'd need CDL.

On edit:
I also just searched the US DOT website and found this:

Class A -- Any combination of vehicles with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds provided the GVWR of the vehicle(s) being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.

I guess it's actually a federal law to have CDL for any trailer with manufacturer GVWR of over 10K.

[xkvator]

I guess it's actually a federal law to have CDL for any trailer with manufacturer GVWR of over 10K.
i know all the salesman at the Bobcat dealer had to get CDL's...they have 1 ton flatbeds and 12T trailers.
I see the DOT stopping pickups & SA dumps pulling trailers at some areas a lot...

[atgreene]

I got pulled over by DOT last week and he explained it like this:

the trailer rating is what they use. If it's rated for over 9999 and being hauled by a truck rated for over 18000, than your moving into class A range.

My Topkick (rated at 29k, rgistered for 36k) can haul my 9999 trailer fine, but not my tri axle trailer because I can't prove it's rated for under 10k, yet they can't prove it's rated for over 10k. He let me drive it home and redtagged it for a dead breakaway battery.

[Orchard Ex]

Class A -- Any combination of vehicles with a GVWR of 26,001 or more pounds provided the GVWR of the vehicle(s) being towed is in excess of 10,000 pounds.

I guess it's actually a federal law to have CDL for any trailer with manufacturer GVWR of over 10K.

The CDL covers the commercial vehicle or vehicle/trailer combo over 26,001lbs and the Class A is for the commercial trailer over 10,000lbs part of the combo.

The kicker is that gramps can tow the 20,000 lb gooseneck travel trailer to jellystone without getting the class A non-commercial license (and if he could do it with a pickup that is 6,000 lbs he wouldn't even need a class B non-commercial)

atgreene - can they not prove the trailer rating because is doesn't have a VIN plate? around here that's enough for a ticket in itself. We can get a VIN for a "homebuilt" trailer from the MVA and rate it for whatever we want. I had to do it for a trailer that came with a VIN sticker that got painted over (I didn't notice when I bought it). Maybe you can get a "homebuilt" VIN for yours and rate it as you want.

[snonut12]

I am still undecided what I will want to do this year, but I don't think I'll expect to be hauling heavy equipment, so I may be looking at deckover dump trailer. Probably 6x10 or 7x12. I think it might be a better setup because of more ground clearance, take less room to manuever, and supposely cheaper. The disadvantage I can all think of is high center of gravity, but is it that bad? Any concern about these? I've compared low profile and deckover, and it seems most deckover are 6-8" higher. Also I won't be able to load heavy equipment. Otherwise are there any other disadvantages of deckover dump trailer?

[Deere John]

Shop in Canada, eh. :drinkup You'll get a great trailer with a front-mounted telescopic hoist and you get to take advantage of your 15% advantage on the exchange rate - your buying power increases.

Check out their Dump Trailers - I am picking up a 10,000 pounder 6 1/2x10 in two weeks time. I too am upsizing from a 7,000 pound capacity. They are in Hamilton.

www.miskatrailers.com

john